I like Lussick, I think he’ll do very well in time. It’s not the first time it’s taken an Aussie a year to settle into our structures, though Woolf staying will help that still I think.
If Dwyer is as terrible as this thread suggests, it’s on our reserves to step up and take the spot. We’ve only seen Pemberton at Cas but I thought he was a highlight that game, and really made an impression. My hope is this will be trying to keep competition for places, whilst avoiding the Dodd situation we have currently.
The issue with Dywer is the opportunity cost , spend cap on him that you can't spend elsewhere.
I think the recent HB woes have highlighted that unless you emeging HBs are full time and ready ,
then you need one of your hookers to be a competent deputy HB as well as a hooker.
If one of those r is not availalbe then I would rather save the cap space
and share second hooker duties between Permberton and Bell.
I'm not a fan of this signing at all. Poor player, slow, laboured, predictable distribution.
I really thought pemberton would have come through and made it and he still may it would also have been nice for Saints to be able to say they have trained their own hookers since , a long time someone will know exactly i only watch them.
There is a thread on Leeds rlfans about players they want to keep started a few weeks back. Not one person wants him to stay and this is a club battling relegation.
His distribution is poor, decision making even worse.
In the club we trust but wow he’s average.
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This is completely true Smith is a much better player than Dwyer. But I wouldn't really want either at the club to be honest so it is a mute point.
I feel like comparing Dwyer to Tommy Lee but Tommy could do a bit of Tackling. Dwyer is just a guy that does a bit of scooting.
I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.
Had a little bit of time to think about this one. My initial reaction was underwhelming and I’m still not convinced. He has looked dangerous as an attacking hooker scooting from dummy half in the past but obviously requires a pack on the front foot to do this. He hasn’t had this at Leeds or his latter time at Warrington so I’m hoping running off the platform our pack will bring the best out of him. He’s a different option to Lussick as well so gives us a bit of variety. I can only hope he’s not on a lot of money and he’s out to prove a point. I’ve seen people compare him to Aaron Smith in ability but he’s a far better player. A short term deal while Pemberton comes through would be ok.
Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.
Have to challenge these comments...
Aaron Smith is currently playing in the championship isn't he? On another loan spell. He's 26 this year and how many games has he played at SL level? Dwyer is a proven second hooker in SL. His best asset is his ability to speed the game up and add zip from dummy half. You can call it scooting if you like but that's what you want from an interchange hooker is it not? He would compliment Lussick's game well I think and so would be a good signing. Tommy Lee's skill set didn't suit what Saints needed at all to work in tandem with Roby, who was comfortably doing 80 minutes at that point anyway. That was a really bizarre signing.
If this rumour is true, it gives a clear indication that Roby is retiring and Saints want to continue playing with two hookers. And so given the above, I think Dwyer is the best one available/realistic option from both off contract lists. I note those on here effectively saying he's a poor signing haven't been able to suggest any alternative options other than Smith or junior players.
*Not to be confused with Mike Stephenson, MBE
Assuming Dwyer is the only option.
Don't sign anyone. Keep your capspace.
Run with Bell /Pembeton to cover the second 9 spot.
Gives you the option to pick up someone
if that doesn't work out or someone good becomes available in 23.
There was nobody so we settled for X.. is not a compeling reason to recruit.
I hear what you're saying Gezza and myself, I'd actually prefer Saints to look at an option that can cover (or actually provide competition) for the halves and speed up dummy half as well, rather than go for an out and out hooker. A Rob Burrow esque player I mean, but these are few and far between. I've already championed the Nikorima brothers on here but Kodi has just signed with Souths and not sure Jayden would come over. No quota space either if Hurrell is retained with the others expected.
I don't know anything of Pembeton so can't comment. I don't see Bell as a playmaker (or a dynamic player which is just as important), from what I've seen. I have seen your comments on Paasi and his ability to offload... that's great, but you then need the players that can get on his shoulder make the break and then convert in to points. Was waiting to see Welsby put his foot down last night when he made the break, but didn't have the gas to finish it off.
Just seen the highlights of the player you like-Nu Brown, getting two tries for Wests in the game earlier. I didn't know he'd gone there.
Last edited by Mike Stephenson; 21st May 2022 at 00:23.
*Not to be confused with Mike Stephenson, MBE
I think theres a bit of once bitten twice shy with this.
Due to the Dodd injury, I dont think we are able to get Pemberton as much game time as we would like (there is also the problem he is still on the yet to be resigned list), and going with Lussick and Pemberton next year leaves us one injury away from starting with a very inexperienced player in a critical position (like we are now).
That leaves us with either;
a) accepting that risk without much mitigation. I have championed Bell playing at 7 this year, so I know the appeal of assuming he can cover key spine positions. Yet despite this, we haven't seen Woolf go for it, and as such I don't think he would be the answer to if we went with Lussick/Pemberton then Lussick getting injured, so I am not really sure what they would do.
b) we sign a pure backup who can cover both halfback and hooker. Assuming this isn't the use of our non-fed spot, that leaves us, going through the yet to be resigned list, with; Corey Johnson (Leeds), Joe Mellor (Leigh), Josh Eaves (Newcastle), Brad Walker (Wakefield) Aaron Smith (Saints). I don't like this option, it feels very much a signing a player who isn't good enough to get our team (Matty Dawson syndrome is my own personal name for it).
c) we sign a specialist first choice and expect Pemberton to take the place of them should he prove himself. The hooker options currently to be resigned are: Da Costa (Catalans), McIlorum (Catalans), Houghton (Hull), Dwyer (Leeds).
d) We get out the cheque book - I assume this isnt an option though - even if it were, whose even worth paying a fee for? McShane is 33 next year, Clark seems a shadow of his former self, Leeming whilst being massively hyped by the Leeds cheerleaders isn't any better than Dwyer.
Its all a bit of a no win situation, but I can't see the club accepting the risk of a), especially after this year. So you have to assume were signing someone.
c) might be seen as bad cap management, but if the club are sensible with their offer in that scenario, and keep it a short deal (1/2 years) or have a backup plan (the offload to Leigh plan) then I think its the most reasonable option out of the ones the club are facing. Whether Dwyer is the best choice out of the ones I have listed though, we could debate until the cows come home.
Is Pemberton out of contract this year? We wanting to keep him I assume?
Last edited by Oberon Sexton; 21st May 2022 at 20:12.
Largely agree. I don’t think the Dwyer signing is as bad as made out: we get cover at the position, he should get chance to utilise his strengths at Saints and I could’nt care less what Leeds fans think. More or less everyone at that club has gone backwards and badly too.
My hope would be for Dwyer to come on under a much stronger set up at Saints. He will need to if Roby retires that’s for sure as his quality of distribution is (along with KC) the best Ive seen in the British game and it’s so important in a game where line speed has become so fast.
[QUOTE=eddiewaringsflatcap;846446]Largely agree. I don’t think the Dwyer signing is as bad as made out: we get cover at the position, he should get chance to utilise his strengths at Saints and I could’nt care less what Leeds fans think. More or less everyone at that club has gone backwards and badly too.
I agree with this. Dwyer is limited but good at what he does and could work well for us rotating with a top of the range 9, but so far Lussick hasn't shown anything like that kind of form. Clearly his opportunites off the bench have been limited, but nothing he has done so far looks to me like a man determined to show that he's worth filling Roby's boots. Of course if his mind is already on an early return to Oz that might explain it, but I have to say that going with him on current form + Dwyer next season doesn't fill me with enthusiasm. (And going with Dwyer + Smith/Pemberton with even less)
Eels have signed Josh Hodgson for 2023 Fishy. Though he suffered another serious knee injury in round 1 this year for Canberra and not likely to play again this season. Not sure if that may change things?
I've said already, it seems Roby is retiring. When he's been asked on TV, he has consistently said he thinks this will be his last year.
*Not to be confused with Mike Stephenson, MBE