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Thread: KC vs Roby

  1. #1
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    Default KC vs Roby

    ROBY

    Ok. A bit of fun.
    Maybe answer first with your choice KC or ROBY as the greatest Hooker in the super league era. And then why

    I dont think theres anything between them, arguably one could cancel out the other one way or another.

    KC... a bit of a freak of nature at times and could run through teams like a world class forward.
    Often unstoppable at the line even when the whole team knew it was coming.
    That wigan tackle where he chased down the winger to throw him into touch.
    The last knowlsey road try
    The lift in the whole team when he was on the pitch, similar to the aura of Scully.
    His toughness and sometimes genuine fear of players to step upto him.

    Roby....
    One of the most consistent and fittest players of all time, sometimes to his detriment as a 9 out of 10 performance could look like under par.
    Decsion making which i think really goes unoticed.. The difference between Roby and someone like Hodgeson for England was like night and day when it came to making the right play at the right time.
    When they both played Roby was just the best impact player from the bench in the League.
    Roby has the better kicking game, possibly the more prolific tackler (i imagine) although KC could be life threatening with his tackling..
    Longevity goes to Roby.. Rarely injured and played more games.

    I havnt forgot how good KC was but lets not forget he also had the backup of Higham and then Roby.

    My vote goes to Roby

    Wilkin said it best.
    Roby consistently 8 to 9 out of 10
    KC could occasionally bring out an 11 out of 10 (something extra special basically)

  2. #2
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    Love Roby but Kieron is the King here, best hooker i've ever seen. Hard as nails tackle anyone and that tackle he tracked back on to tackle the Wigan player in the corner of Knowsley Road and bungle him into touch was sublime.

    Kieron 10/10
    Roby 9.9/10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwfxFjF1a8E

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rommel View Post
    Love Roby but Kieron is the King here, best hooker i've ever seen. Hard as nails tackle anyone and that tackle he tracked back on to tackle the Wigan player in the corner of Knowsley Road and bungle him into touch was sublime.

    Kieron 10/10
    Roby 9.9/10

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwfxFjF1a8E
    I'd agree. Keiron was the ultimate player. He tackled like a prop, he hurt people. Robes will put up big numbers and do it machine like, but Keiron made a bigger impact. With the ball they're both brilliant, Roby more scheming, Keiron more clinical and deadly, both with scooting and passing.

    Robes has had to deal with a much harder time of things, he hasn't generally had the players with him that Keiron had. But Keiron had some horrific injuries to overcome and definitely played in a much stronger era for rugby league in this country. The standard has markedly declined every year Roby has been playing and it's now a shadow of what it was when he started playing.

    Robes definitely deserves a bronze outside the stadium. But there are probably a few others who deserve on as well, which shows how successful we've been as a club. Who could argue with Joynt, Roby, Wellens, Newlove, Long, Sullivan, Perelini, Martyn and Sculthorpe getting one. We should really have a legend every 50 feet or so around the stadium, but I suspect the club don't have a few hundred thousand spare to pay for that just now.

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    Starting A Programme Collection Saintsaregods's Avatar
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    Tough one, KC was surrounded by better players I’d argue, JR the most consistent player I’ve seen and I’ll never understand how he hasn’t got more MOS awards.

    KC my favourite Saints player, one of only two names I ever had on my shirt, the other being Lyon. I’m giving it to KC but not lightly, he had that destructive quality with skill to match, changed the role of hooker and rightly earned his status as legend.

    This is an argument that could on for years, I’m feel privileged to have seen both start and finish their careers.

    Both truly deserve their legend status.

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    It's a difficult one for me as it was only around 2004 that I was of the age where I started to appreciate the nuances of the game so for most of Cunningham's career I saw him playing his best rugby with either Higham or Roby spelling him. I think KC at his best is better than Roby at his best but Roby consistently put in a higher average performance. Both were excellent dummy half runners with ball in hand at their peak with KC better close to the line and Roby better in defence with a kicking game as well, quite a lot of Roby's career he's been an 80 minute hooker as well. I'd go Roby based on all that but if I was picking an all time Saints time you'd probably want to start KC, bring Roby on after 25, bring KC back on in the 2nd half, play Roby at loose forward for the rest of the match and go with dual hookers for the last 25. They were devastating working as a duo.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

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    CUNNINGHAM

    ...... but only by the narrowest of margins. The tackle on Mark Smith tips the balance in my opinion - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwfxFjF1a8E
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    Cunningham by a hair because on his day he was otherworldly. Could argue Roby has been better value overall though with his consistency.

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    Roby is a St Helens legend but Cunningham was the better player overall

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    It’s like choosing red sauce or brown sauce, both great in their own right, the world would be a poorer place without them and all boils down to personal preference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by retro74 View Post
    Roby is a St Helens legend but Cunningham was the better player overall
    It could be argued that Cunningham was in a better side overall than Roby has been in recent years personally I don't think he had the same work rate as Roby when he had the likes of Joynt, Sculthorpe and co. to do all tackling and heavy work, and a young Roby to come on while he had a break

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffs View Post
    It’s like choosing red sauce or brown sauce, both great in their own right, the world would be a poorer place without them and all boils down to personal preference.
    Which one is brown sauce though? He’s the better player for me

  12. #12
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    Tough to choose. But push comes to shove, Cunningham in his prime over Roby for me

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    Starting A Programme Collection Roger Moore's Avatar
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    I'll buck the trend. Roby for me, simply because his consistent brilliance went unnoticed for a long time. He rarely got MOM when deserved and should have more Man of Steel, because what you got from Roby was 9.5 out of 10 every week, so it seemed nothing special. But hey it really was.
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    Great arguments made for both in this thread.

    I'm going to be the one with a splintery arse because although very different players with very different attributes and skills, they are both 10/10 players when judged over their whole careers.

    What's beyond argument is that they are the best two hookers to have played in Super League, almost certainly the best two ever in the British/European game. There've been pretenders like Lowes, Clarke, maybe even briefly Houghton but none could hold a candle overall to either of Cunningham or Roby.
    Last edited by Gray77; 24th August 2021 at 11:09.

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    Roby without doubt for me. His engine, longevity and consistency are unmatched in SL. KC wouldn't have had half the career he had if he had played the minutes Roby has.
    Last edited by Belgian Saint; 20th August 2021 at 04:46.

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    Maybe how Roby perorms in his last year could just push a few peoples opinion..

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    Toby for me, but obviously very close. Repeating what lots have said, Cunningham more spectacular and destructive (defence and attack) on his day, but Roby more consistent and playing in lesser teams. I would add that I just asked 3 of my mates (2 Widnes and one Leeds) and they said Roby without hesitation which I was surprised with as I would think KC was the more eye catching.

  18. #18
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    Cunningham for me. Especially in the oppositions 20. He was so dangerous from DH that teams had to put 3/4 players near him which helped create time and space for the rest. He could hit, he could run, distribution was fantastic and I could be wrong but I think he has created more tries from DH than any other hooker.

    We have been very lucky to have the 2 best hookers in SL to play for us, which meant we had no room for Micky Higham who would have been in the 17 every week any other era.

    Either way, the club should seriously consider making room next to KC for another statue, especially if we win a few more finals before he retires.

  19. #19
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    I loved KC but Roby for me carried the club for 7/8 years and is still going to a very high quailty.
    Learned comment from The Don

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouse Don View Post
    I loved KC but Roby for me carried the club for 7/8 years and is still going to a very high quailty.
    This. Robes has carried average players whilst KC was surrounded by talent of the highest order and had Robes to spell him towards the end. Robes has not had this luxury, usually plays the full 80 and is an inspiration. Maybe not as eye catching as KC but his work rate is second to none. A humble, loyal. skilful, workaholic of a man, Roby for me.

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    A terrible memory and recency bias probably moves me towards Roby but both were/are absolutely world class. Easily the 2 best hookers in the summer era. Insane in how lucky we have been over the last 25 years.

  22. #22
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    Two great players and two legends of the club, KC was a beast of a player, all pace power and a prolific try scorer.

    Roby a superb all round player, great engine and incredible work rate as well as a superb rugby brain

    I'd probably edge towards KC but both are top top level players , world class

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffs View Post
    It’s like choosing red sauce or brown sauce, both great in their own right, the world would be a poorer place without them and all boils down to personal preference.
    Choosing between Phil Adamson and Ricky Bibey would be the equivalent of choosing between red and brown sauce.
    THIS YEAR LENDING SUPPORT TO:- St. Helens RLFC, Manchester City, Celtic, Alemannia Aachen, Steps 1 to 6 Non-League Football

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    It's a very tough call.

    Roby's durability, fitness and longevity counts in his favour, but Cunningham just had a little bit more to his game. He had that killer pass next to the line to put players in for a try, which was something that he still managed to do when the rest of his game was failing him. He just had a tad more quality and organisation about him.

    Therefore, I've got to go with Cunningham.
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    Cunningham played with some fantastic players who all made each other look better (Longy, Scully, Wellens) but still, he was fantastic.
    Roby has shone and carried us through some transitional periods and shone carrying some poor players around him.
    Roby has had some poor moments from dummy half and killed the plays at times, but still, when you consider his sheer work rate, durability, consistency, fitness and GF performances he’s one of the best players I’ve ever seen.

    But Cunningham is still the best hooker Ive ever seen.
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