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Thread: Wire’s salary sombrero

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    Default Wire’s salary sombrero

    Discuss????? We’re losing players left right and centre due to SC restrictions and there throwing money around at anyone who’s available

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    Quote Originally Posted by BbrookTM View Post
    Discuss????? We’re losing players left right and centre due to SC restrictions and there throwing money around at anyone who’s available
    Now Williams apparently going to Warrington, I believe their accountant is also negotiating for a driving licence for Stevie Wonder

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    Don't worry they'll still have room under their cap for Robert Hicks

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    I know we all joke about Wire but they have used pretty much all the available salary cap exemptions at one time or another. They use their marquee spots, they’ve taken advantage of dispensations for new and returning talent from rugby union like Burrell & Charnley and next year they’ll save £50,000 off the combined salaries of Ratchford & Hill due to them being in their 11th consecutive season with the same club. There’s also up to £100,000 available for homegrown players that they can use on the likes of King, Cooper, Currie & Philbin.

    They make a lot of big signings but it’s also a bit of a revolving door as well. When you add up the salaries of Inglis, Widdop, Austin and Clark they could all be on their way out and that’s a lot of money to play with.
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    We have Grace from Rugby Union, Percival, Makinson, Lomax, Roby (if he doesn't retire), Welsby, Lees came through system. Allegedly Fages, Coote, Naquama, Bentley leaving, not counting any who may be retiring. So we should have a decent amount of money available as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BbrookTM View Post
    Discuss????? We’re losing players left right and centre due to SC restrictions and there throwing money around at anyone who’s available
    I think we need to focus on ourselves and stop worrying about them.

    They have a very wealthy owner so money not really an object. They haven't been done for any salary cap infringements. We have although a long time ago. They will win super league sooner rather than later. I suspect this season. They're a good team who have us sussed.

    Post 2021, we will struggle for a while. Need to rebuild and bring the average age of the squad down. Too many over 30s in the side. The way this sport is being played getting bashed for 80 minutes, most will peak mid 20s.

    We need some real aggression at prop, and 2 big back rowers who can play rugby. Why Norman isn't playing is beyond me. Get him in the team. We need a 9 as well. And we should be looking at Parcell

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    Is it only 75k of homegrown players salary that goes on the cap aswel?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I think we need to focus on ourselves and stop worrying about them.

    They have a very wealthy owner so money not really an object. They haven't been done for any salary cap infringements. We have although a long time ago. They will win super league sooner rather than later.
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    Default Wire’s salary sombrero

    Quote Originally Posted by Western suburbs View Post
    Is it only 75k of homegrown players salary that goes on the cap aswel?
    Only if you’re talking about a marquee player. Otherwise there’s just a general £100k flat ‘reward’ for producing home-grown players (not sure how many you need to qualify).

    From the RFL website:

    Quote Originally Posted by The RFL
    The key dispensations are:

    Marquee Player – Each Super League and Championship Club is permitted to have two Marquee Players whose Salary Cap value is limited to £150,000 (or £75,000 if Club Trained);

    Club Trained Dispensation – Each Super League club is given up to £100,000 of dispensation for producing Super League standard players;

    Player Welfare Dispensation – Each Super League Club that achieves the player welfare target is given a £15,000 dispensation;

    New Talent Pool Dispensation – Any Player who has not previously played Rugby League is given a value of £0 in the first year of his contract and at 50% of his true value in the second year;

    Returning Talent Pool Dispensation – Any Player who has not previously played rugby league in the 5 years prior to signing is given a value of 50% of his true value in the first year of his contract and 75% of his true value in the second year;

    International Bonuses – Bonuses paid for international representation are excluded up to specified maximums;

    Educational fees paid directly by Clubs are excluded; and

    Prize money – Payments made out of prize money are excluded.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I think we need to focus on ourselves and stop worrying about them.

    They have a very wealthy owner so money not really an object. They haven't been done for any salary cap infringements. We have although a long time ago. They will win super league sooner rather than later. I suspect this season. They're a good team who have us sussed.

    Post 2021, we will struggle for a while. Need to rebuild and bring the average age of the squad down. Too many over 30s in the side. The way this sport is being played getting bashed for 80 minutes, most will peak mid 20s.

    We need some real aggression at prop, and 2 big back rowers who can play rugby. Why Norman isn't playing is beyond me. Get him in the team. We need a 9 as well. And we should be looking at Parcell
    I agree with most of that but not too sure about the wealthy owner bit. I thought the purpose of the salary cap was to stop wealthy owners throwing money at a club.

    I don't know the rules but I've always assumed basis of the cap was that the spending on the team had to be in relation to the clubs income.
    I sure there are ways a wealthy owner could subsidise some of the clubs overheads but I don't think he can just throw money at the team

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    Thanks, i often wondered how much help it was to have club trained players in your squad.
    So for instance it would make buisness sense for say lomax an Makinson or high earning club trained players to be our marquee
    Only 150k on the cap?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Infamous Grouse View Post
    I agree with most of that but not too sure about the wealthy owner bit. I thought the purpose of the salary cap was to stop wealthy owners throwing money at a club.

    I don't know the rules but I've always assumed basis of the cap was that the spending on the team had to be in relation to the clubs income.
    I sure there are ways a wealthy owner could subsidise some of the clubs overheads but I don't think he can just throw money at the team
    I'm not sure about the 'income' bit, but I would assume a wealthy owner could 'top up' a clubs player wage budget to the cap limit if the club were having a cash flow problem like we're seeing now with the restrictions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Infamous Grouse View Post
    I agree with most of that but not too sure about the wealthy owner bit. I thought the purpose of the salary cap was to stop wealthy owners throwing money at a club.

    I don't know the rules but I've always assumed basis of the cap was that the spending on the team had to be in relation to the clubs income.
    I sure there are ways a wealthy owner could subsidise some of the clubs overheads but I don't think he can just throw money at the team
    Sorry IG, I was too vague. I meant that they can spend up to cap constantly. Once they nail the recruitment (Mulhern is a great signing), then they can pay decent wages to good players. Price gets a lot of stick but I don't think he's that bad a coach at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    I know we all joke about Wire but they have used pretty much all the available salary cap exemptions at one time or another. They use their marquee spots, they’ve taken advantage of dispensations for new and returning talent from rugby union like Burrell & Charnley and next year they’ll save £50,000 off the combined salaries of Ratchford & Hill due to them being in their 11th consecutive season with the same club. There’s also up to £100,000 available for homegrown players that they can use on the likes of King, Cooper, Currie & Philbin.

    They make a lot of big signings but it’s also a bit of a revolving door as well. When you add up the salaries of Inglis, Widdop, Austin and Clark they could all be on their way out and that’s a lot of money to play with.
    I complain about their signings as much as anyone, but the above puts their use of the SC into perspective.

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    Yeah, I’ve no problem with Warrington’s approach to managing their salary cap. They use the rules well in terms of rugby union players, marquees etc. It’s Wigan’s creative accountancy every few years that gets my back up. How they’ve never been hit hard is beyond me.
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    They are losing a lot of players at the end of this season so they have cap space. It’s strictly policed these days so just need to trust the process.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Albion View Post
    They are losing a lot of players at the end of this season so they have cap space. It’s strictly policed these days so just need to trust the process.
    Of Course it is. Like I trust the referee to referee both sides the same.

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    Warrington lost £750K last year (2020) and are expected to lose a similar or even larger amount in 2021. However Moran and his other directors are prepared to cover that loss. You would think that Morans businesses would have been hit really hard during the pandemic with no big concerts going on.

    Warrington have been probably been the only club along with Leeds who have been running at a profit over the last eight years.

    It'll be interesting to see how other clubs have performed financially over the "covid period"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogues Gallery View Post
    Warrington lost £750K last year (2020) and are expected to lose a similar or even larger amount in 2021. However Moran and his other directors are prepared to cover that loss. You would think that Morans businesses would have been hit really hard during the pandemic with no big concerts going on.

    Warrington have been probably been the only club along with Leeds who have been running at a profit over the last eight years.

    It'll be interesting to see how other clubs have performed financially over the "covid period"
    I must admit I thought the same. Concert and festivals have been virtually at a stand still for over a year now.
    Warrington’s order benefactor is the guy who owns Card Factory and again they can’t have had a brilliant time of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogues Gallery View Post
    ...It'll be interesting to see how other clubs have performed financially over the "covid period"
    It was said fairly early on that Saints and Leeds were hit hard due to the lost function room letting/corporate side of the business model.
    Obviously, your lot wouldn't have that problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KentishBarry View Post
    It was said fairly early on that Saints and Leeds were hit hard due to the lost function room letting/corporate side of the business model.
    Obviously, your lot wouldn't have that problem.
    I wonder how much we got from the government for letting out the stadium for vaccinations?

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    The same accusations were once hurled at Saints.

    I think it's entirely feasible that both Austin and Widdop will be leaving at the end of the year, so it's a non-discussion.

    The concerning thing is that they move for the big name players and we don't. It's been fifteen years now since we ever competed for top drawer players in the market.
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    Lets not be naïve, Saints are not doing it for a "new shagpile" if that doesn't offend Rogues, we are getting a slice from that. The reality is Warrington is a rich town and a big town, BUT it is not a rugby town. Hence they produce little or nothing of their own. Hence the culture has never been quite right. One off competitions like the CC you can get by, but to be Champions is different gravy. Leeds always had the cash, Hunslet the players. Leeds first ever Championship? 1961.

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    I'm not sure it's spectacularly different once you've got to the knock-out stages, and they frequently do. Being Champions lost that kudos when we reverted to the old-RL style formula of allowing teams from half way down the league to take part in an end of season knock-out competition to win the Final.

    If we go back to that wait for Leeds, was anybody that bothered? The Championship was very much second fiddle to the Challenge Cup and it wasn't unheard of for teams to rest players for Championship Semi-Finals ahead of/a week after Wembley. There was more than the odd occasion when players were on a ship to Australia for the Ashes when the Championship Play-Offs were being played.

    There was a much bigger millstone around Saints neck not having won the Cup until 1956 than there was around Leeds' for not winning the Championship. Even when I started watching the game, winning the Challenge Cup took precedence. Widnes could have won a number of League Championships in the late 70s and early 80s had they not got to Wembley and rested players continually. Getting to Wembley frequently cost teams the Championship because Wembley was prioritised.
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    The concerning thing is that they move for the big name players and we don't. It's been fifteen years now since we ever competed for top drawer players in the market.[/QUOTE]

    ?

    Ben barber - nrl player of the year
    Lachlan coote - nrl grand final winner regarded as top draw in the nrl
    Kevin naiqama - fiji captain at the time, west tiger main attacking player in the backline
    Joel thompson - whole of nrl was shocked he came to england even rejected other nrl contracts
    Sione matautia - mainsted in the newcastle team one of their longest serving players. Rejected gold costs to come here


    Yes we have also had the like of luke douglas and ryan morgan etc but some of our recent signings have also been top class signings that could have easily stayed in the nrl.

    Wire signing widdop and tyrone rkberts was laughable. Both couldnt get gigs in the nrl and wire still paid over the odds wages to sign them. Widdop was busted when they signed him and took them 1 year to get anything from him.

    Austin again rookie in the nrl no one wanted him to be a starter, wire took a chance and to some extent it worked off so fair play

    Inglis - lol what a waste of money. Probs safe to say the most highest paid player in SL right now and of reputation rightly so. But .... the guy was retired for 2 years due to injury. It was clearly never going to work. Looking back i bet they are kicking themselves for spending the money and not investing in youth or other options

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