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Thread: Transfer Rumours - All in Here

  1. #351
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    I’m not suggesting that Dodd doesn’t have the potential to make the grade, but I’m not sure of anything that he’s done in the first team to date that betters anything that Fages has contributed to the team.
    he has a far better kicking game , fages kicks on the last play are often poor tbh

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    Perhaps one of the biggest rebuilding phases the club has ever had to undertake is coming and it just seems like they are sleep walking into it. We've potentially got Coote, Naiqama, Fages, Roby, Bentley, Amor and LMS from the starting 17 leaving. We're linked with absolutely no one at the moment, bar some young forward from Bradford.

    We could bring in Welsby, Simm and Dodd for the first three and Smith/Eaves for Roby. But it's a huge risk and will unquestionably be a reduction in the quality in the side overall.

    With Woolf's contract still being up in the air and so many first team players leaving, I do wonder if this will be a proper rebuilding phase and we'll drop to mid table for a few seasons? It's hard to see how we can realistically maintain a top 4 spot if we're not going to be signing anyone given the quality of those leaving.
    I think we dropped as far as we can drop under KC, and we quickly recovered. I don't see us dropping too far. We have to trust in the system and trust that we are producing players good enough to make the first team and prosper. Over the SL era we have done pretty well promoting from within, and some of the genuinely top class players we have had in our teams in that time didn't cost us a penny and came from within. These lads may not end up to be at the level of Wellens, Cunningham, Roby, etc, but nobody thought those lads would end up at the level they were going to reach either I suspect.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post
    I think we dropped as far as we can drop under KC, and we quickly recovered. I don't see us dropping too far. We have to trust in the system and trust that we are producing players good enough to make the first team and prosper. Over the SL era we have done pretty well promoting from within, and some of the genuinely top class players we have had in our teams in that time didn't cost us a penny and came from within. These lads may not end up to be at the level of Wellens, Cunningham, Roby, etc, but nobody thought those lads would end up at the level they were going to reach either I suspect.
    I remember people going crackers about how Roby was never going to be good enough and we were crazy letting Higham go. I also remember people suggesting we should bin off Luke Thompson and focus purely on Richards... youth development is a funny world with fans!

    Lots of decisions over the next few years, as said above we have to trust in the processes. I am sure we’re talking to the right people and have some plans but the club is always so secretive over such things!

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    It's the nature of sport, some players have great long careers, they still have to retire in the end and be replaced. There are always lots of fans who think those about to replace them aren't as good. Over the years, Saints have been through it many times & have managed the transition well. I expect them to do the same again. We have some of the best young talent in the country & I look forward to seing the incoming young players build great careers of their own for us to enjoy for years to come.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Stephenson View Post
    It's been reported Brisbane are looking at him and I'm sure after today's game they got a very good look!

    Walsh has been really good hasn't he? And at just 18. Sam Walker in the halves at the Roosters has been the same. Apparently he was at Brisbane too.



    Hodgson divides opinion over here but he's done so well in the NRL and regarded as one of the top 3 hookers in the competition for several years. Not many would've predicted that, when he went over from Hull KR. I think he'll stay in the NRL. Brisbane have inquired about Dane Gagai, Kurt Capewell as well as Hodgson and Dufty. Depends what cap space they have and who they can offload first.
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    It’s not a job! We do try to keep an eye and we do deal with reported posts when necessary.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Stephenson View Post
    It's been reported Brisbane are looking at him and I'm sure after today's game they got a very good look!

    Walsh has been really good hasn't he? And at just 18. Sam Walker in the halves at the Roosters has been the same. Apparently he was at Brisbane too.



    Hodgson divides opinion over here but he's done so well in the NRL and regarded as one of the top 3 hookers in the competition for several years. Not many would've predicted that, when he went over from Hull KR. I think he'll stay in the NRL. Brisbane have inquired about Dane Gagai, Kurt Capewell as well as Hodgson and Dufty. Depends what cap space they have and who they can offload first.
    Quote Originally Posted by JB1973 View Post
    he has a far better kicking game , fages kicks on the last play are often poor tbh
    Where have you witnessed Dodds kicking game over a sustained period? Theo's kicking game has improved, though far from being excellent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    As to how much of a rebuilding phase we might be in I think depends a lot on those with contracts up at the end of next season. As far as I can make out this is the current contract list. There are one year options for some:

    2021: Coote, Fages, Naiqama, Bentley, Roby, Amor, LMS, Batchelor, Eaves, Rizzelli, Royle, Nisbet, Davies

    2022: Knowles, Lees, Grace, Makinson, Paasi, Thompson, Mata’utia, Simm, Welsby, Smith, Norman

    2023: Wingfield, Dodd

    2024: Lomax, Percival, Walmsley

    Now that’s potentially 7 out of our match day 17 moving on this year with another 7 the year after. Now I don’t expect all of them to leave but as it stands we only have 3 nailed on 1st 17 players contracted past the end of next season.

    The next 18 months will define the next few years as to how many of the 24 OOC players we can retain, what youth we have to promote and how effectively we can fill the gaps from outside the club.

    Worth pointing out as well that we’ve gone through transition periods before and still never missed out on the play offs only finishing outside the top 4 twice, 5th both times.
    It would be interesting to see how that list compares with other clubs over the same period.






    But I can't be ar$ed doing the research.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    As to how much of a rebuilding phase we might be in I think depends a lot on those with contracts up at the end of next season. As far as I can make out this is the current contract list. There are one year options for some:

    2021: Coote, Fages, Naiqama, Bentley, Roby, Amor, LMS, Batchelor, Eaves, Rizzelli, Royle, Nisbet, Davies

    2022: Knowles, Lees, Grace, Makinson, Paasi, Thompson, Mata’utia, Simm, Welsby, Smith, Norman

    2023: Wingfield, Dodd

    2024: Lomax, Percival, Walmsley
    I suppose Lomax and Walmsley don't count really as they'll both be 34 by the end of the 2024 season and we'll be needing to move on from them anyway, whilst to be honest I'd be delighted if re-signing Percival in 3.5 years was something that we really needed to do if you get what I mean.

    As for the 2021 ones, well I think we all assume we'll lose anywhere between 3 and 6 of the ones who end this season, but if you look at is a group I'm fairly relaxed about it really because there are some decent earners on that list who will free up some cap space, and we are still a club that players will want to play for. If we lose a handful we will fill in the gaps with the lads we have coming through or a couple of new recruits, I don't think we need to worry too much.

    It's the end of 2022 that we need to worry about IMO. Within the list are some of the lads that we should be building a team around in the next 5-10 years and other lads who we already rely heavily on and are elite players in their positions. I think if we give the young lads enough time on the park and enough guarantees that they are the future bedrocks of the side then they will all happily re-sign, but there are names on that 2022 list that I wouldn't want us to do without and they are the worry because they will have plenty of other options, and good ones as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tilly2006 View Post
    It would be interesting to see how that list compares with other clubs over the same period.






    But I can't be ar$ed doing the research.
    I should imagine there are quite a few clubs sleepwalking into obscurity with players off contract with no back up from home grown talent. Probably the Wigoons should be well placed they blood their young players early especially in the forwards.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    The m.o.s. scoring system is seriously flawed but to say McShane isn't good enough for us is harsh. Not that we would sign him but he is a very good player.

    Parcell would do a good job for us. He's decent
    I'm Surprised Parcell hasn't been mentioned before. Always played well against us at Leeds,but I don't think he's had too much game time at HKR. Sure he would do a good job,having said that I don't see a lot wrong with Smith. We've been spoiled with Cunningham and Roby.

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    Quote Originally Posted by knowsleyroaders View Post
    I'm Surprised Parcell hasn't been mentioned before. Always played well against us at Leeds,but I don't think he's had too much game time at HKR. Sure he would do a good job,having said that I don't see a lot wrong with Smith. We've been spoiled with Cunningham and Roby.
    He’s been mentioned quite a bit before on this thread and on the OOC list thread before that. He’s really the only suitable and feasible hooking option to sign from the rest of super league.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notawiginfan View Post
    Where have you witnessed Dodds kicking game over a sustained period? Theo's kicking game has improved, though far from being excellent.
    only in his brief cameos. I have to respectfully disagree on fages kicking game, I find it poor both in selection and execution. For a half back in a trophy winning side his kicking game is very weak. I think Dodds will be a better a player and imo he already will develop a superior kicking and passing game to fages although I grant you he may not be as good in defence

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    Quote Originally Posted by JB1973 View Post
    only in his brief cameos. I have to respectfully disagree on fages kicking game, I find it poor both in selection and execution. For a half back in a trophy winning side his kicking game is very weak. I think Dodds will be a better a player and imo he already will develop a superior kicking and passing game to fages although I grant you he may not be as good in defence
    I agree with this. It would be hard to get a better defensive scrum half than Fages, but surely defence isn't the main job of a scrum half? I think Dodds will improve the team but Woolf thinks Fages is the better bet obviously. I hope Dodds has some half back time soon

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    No it isnt the main job but it is now a factor. Richardson has got an opinion on why he is in a team. Lomax did not agree with Richardson, hence Theo became first choice partner. Dodds must be able to hold his own and Lomax will guide him for 12 months. What he is getting now is exposure, he is around the senior team and cameo appearances build confidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyprus View Post
    No it isnt the main job but it is now a factor. Richardson has got an opinion on why he is in a team. Lomax did not agree with Richardson, hence Theo became first choice partner. Dodds must be able to hold his own and Lomax will guide him for 12 months. What he is getting now is exposure, he is around the senior team and cameo appearances build confidence.
    Yes, fair point but I think Dodds is good enough in defence already. I agree that he’s getting valuable game time but is hooker the right place to put him? I don’t know

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    Yes, fair point but I think Dodds is good enough in defence already. I agree that he’s getting valuable game time but is hooker the right place to put him? I don’t know
    I think there’s a big difference in defending as a hooker in the middle compared with being a half back on the edge. As the former, you may have props coming at you but it is rare that you are the only defender attempting to stop them. As a half back, however, you are more likely to be asked to tackle one-on-one a centre or second row, either of whom are normally faster and more agile than a prop. Dodd has certainly defended acceptably to date but bigger tests will have to be faced when he is selected as half back. Hopefully, he will be up to it but you only have to read the Casforum to see what fans think of a half (Richardson) failing to defend adequately.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    I think there’s a big difference in defending as a hooker in the middle compared with being a half back on the edge. As the former, you may have props coming at you but it is rare that you are the only defender attempting to stop them. As a half back, however, you are more likely to be asked to tackle one-on-one a centre or second row, either of whom are normally faster and more agile than a prop. Dodd has certainly defended acceptably to date but bigger tests will have to be faced when he is selected as half back. Hopefully, he will be up to it but you only have to read the Casforum to see what fans think of a half (Richardson) failing to defend adequately.
    Yes, good point. We will only know when he gets a run of minutes in the appropriate position. I don’t understand why he is coming on at hooker but I’m no rugby genius so there could be an excellent reason

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    I think there’s a big difference in defending as a hooker in the middle compared with being a half back on the edge. As the former, you may have props coming at you but it is rare that you are the only defender attempting to stop them. As a half back, however, you are more likely to be asked to tackle one-on-one a centre or second row, either of whom are normally faster and more agile than a prop. Dodd has certainly defended acceptably to date but bigger tests will have to be faced when he is selected as half back. Hopefully, he will be up to it but you only have to read the Casforum to see what fans think of a half (Richardson) failing to defend adequately.
    Spot on

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    I think there’s a big difference in defending as a hooker in the middle compared with being a half back on the edge. As the former, you may have props coming at you but it is rare that you are the only defender attempting to stop them. As a half back, however, you are more likely to be asked to tackle one-on-one a centre or second row, either of whom are normally faster and more agile than a prop. Dodd has certainly defended acceptably to date but bigger tests will have to be faced when he is selected as half back. Hopefully, he will be up to it but you only have to read the Casforum to see what fans think of a half (Richardson) failing to defend adequately.
    From what little I've seen of Dodd, his tackling technique looks sound enough. Richardson looked wary of the contact & to tended to grab at the opponent or get bounced off due to not getting his shoulder into position. Time will tell of course.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2112_Saint View Post
    From what little I've seen of Dodd, his tackling technique looks sound enough. Richardson looked wary of the contact & to tended to grab at the opponent or get bounced off due to not getting his shoulder into position. Time will tell of course.
    Dodd looks like a good tackler. He certainly tackles above his weight. I just hope we have plenty experience around him next year to help ease him in. It wouldn’t be fair to lump on him all the expectation in a team in massive transition.
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2112_Saint View Post
    From what little I've seen of Dodd, his tackling technique looks sound enough. Richardson looked wary of the contact & to tended to grab at the opponent or get bounced off due to not getting his shoulder into position. Time will tell of course.
    When Dodd had his full game debut against Salford he made a 38 tackles and missed 3 tackles. Richardson if he made so many tackles he would very likely miss very close to 10 tackles, we also remember Walsh had a pretty high missed tackle count as well. Dodd has been learning some tackle technique with Roby in training and at the moment is going for the legs side on.

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    Where people like Richardson and Jamie Foster go wrong is through youth RL they have got by with a huge amount of fairy dust. Then you hit the big time and its men who are hard, fast and skilful and you need some sort of defence. Murphy and John Woods both used to laugh and say we are not here to tackle. BUT they did and knew when and knew how. Dodds doesn't need to be Theo, but at Saints, Wheeler, Richardson, Gaskell, Foster you soon get found out and moved on. Normally down. Fair play to Theo he is moving down but for a kings ransom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    When Dodd had his full game debut against Salford he made a 38 tackles and missed 3 tackles. Richardson if he made so many tackles he would very likely miss very close to 10 tackles, we also remember Walsh had a pretty high missed tackle count as well. Dodd has been learning some tackle technique with Roby in training and at the moment is going for the legs side on.
    That's great news, not many better than Roby to learn from, he already looks competent. Dodd looks to have the right attitude to defence, get stuck in & do your share.

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    Numerous Aussie posters on Reddit Claiming Dufty is nailed on for us as Brisbane have pulled out and Coote is going home?

    Anyone in the know over here heard anything?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    Yes, good point. We will only know when he gets a run of minutes in the appropriate position. I don’t understand why he is coming on at hooker but I’m no rugby genius so there could be an excellent reason
    The reason is just to get him minutes on the pitch and get him used to the physicality of super league. Woolf obviously doesn’t want to mess with the half backs no matter what the match situation so I’d rather see Dodd in these 15 minute cameos than not at all.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

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