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Thread: Super League take over.

  1. #26
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk Belgian Saint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CGSaint View Post
    Having the officials be more accountable needs looking at aswell.
    I think that has been atrocious this year. So inconsistent.. But what is done?? Nothing I imagine.
    I agree with you but, you pay peanuts you know what you get. NRL Refs can earn up to $300, 000 PA. I don't know what RFL Refs earn, but seemed to remember a couple of years ago someone posting that it was in the high twenties. I don't know how many of them have other jobs, but I remember Hewer dropping out for a while because he could not afford to stop work and ref full time. Though i'm aware that paying more doesn't guarantee a higher standard, but it would give more choice of refs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    I agree with you but, you pay peanuts you know what you get. NRL Refs can earn up to $300, 000 PA. I don't know what RFL Refs earn, but seemed to remember a couple of years ago someone posting that it was in the high twenties. I don't know how many of them have other jobs, but I remember Hewer dropping out for a while because he could not afford to stop work and ref full time. Though i'm aware that paying more doesn't guarantee a higher standard, but it would give more choice of refs.
    A higher wage would probably be an incentive for people to forge a career in being a ref.

    Higher wage with stricter punishments for poor performance would help increase the ability of refs.


    What we have now seems to be who can do the biggest gaff of the round and still get paid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    I agree with you but, you pay peanuts you know what you get. NRL Refs can earn up to $300, 000 PA. I don't know what RFL Refs earn, but seemed to remember a couple of years ago someone posting that it was in the high twenties. I don't know how many of them have other jobs, but I remember Hewer dropping out for a while because he could not afford to stop work and ref full time. Though i'm aware that paying more doesn't guarantee a higher standard, but it would give more choice of refs.
    I found and posted the figures a few years ago but can’t find anything now apart from NRL refs earning more than Super League players. I think I found that top flight U.K. RL refs were on a basic pay of about 38,000, which was quite a bit lower than top flight RU refs in the U.K.

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    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk Belgian Saint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suttoner View Post
    I found and posted the figures a few years ago but can’t find anything now apart from NRL refs earning more than Super League players. I think I found that top flight U.K. RL refs were on a basic pay of about 38,000, which was quite a bit lower than top flight RU refs in the U.K.
    Thanks. I remembered someone posting figures. I actually thought it was lower than that. Although it's not a fortune, it's probably OK for the hours they put in.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    Im wondering what assets there would actually be to strip? .
    They could make a fortune selling Odsal as a landfill site .
    On the Back foot looking for the front one.

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    Money is an issue all round.. And clearly is an issue if its not an attractive wage. Although I'm not knocking it. Getting paid to stay fit and active and be involved in rugby league sounds like a good deal to me

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greengrass View Post
    They could make a fortune selling Odsal as a landfill site .
    But Odsal is owned by the RFL - presumably an investor would be investing in SL?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sinkers89 View Post
    A higher wage would probably be an incentive for people to forge a career in being a ref.

    Higher wage with stricter punishments for poor performance would help increase the ability of refs.


    What we have now seems to be who can do the biggest gaff of the round and still get paid.
    Agreed but to be fair the view the ref's get at pitch level is often obstructed.

    I guess the options are to have two refs as the Aussies were doing pre Covid.

    Or involve the Video ref more, at the moment he is used for try and or restart decisions and incidents of foul play but could he work in tandem with ref advising on other decisions.
    At the moment the touch judges are in contact with the ref, if they see an incident in the tackle or a knock on they call it and the ref takes their word for it, could the video ref do the same if he sees something from his vantage point that the on-field ref has missed.

    Obviously he couldn't review everything or we would end up like American football, an hour of action and two hours of stoppages

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    Quote Originally Posted by Infamous Grouse View Post
    Agreed but to be fair the view the ref's get at pitch level is often obstructed.

    I guess the options are to have two refs as the Aussies were doing pre Covid.

    Or involve the Video ref more, at the moment he is used for try and or restart decisions and incidents of foul play but could he work in tandem with ref advising on other decisions.
    At the moment the touch judges are in contact with the ref, if they see an incident in the tackle or a knock on they call it and the ref takes their word for it, could the video ref do the same if he sees something from his vantage point that the on-field ref has missed.

    Obviously he couldn't review everything or we would end up like American football, an hour of action and two hours of stoppages
    The problem is you do all of this, it costs a load of money, you end up with a game that is littered with arbitrary breaks in play and people still kick off about the decisions because thats the nature of sport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    The problem is you do all of this, it costs a load of money, you end up with a game that is littered with arbitrary breaks in play and people still kick off about the decisions because that’s the nature of sport.
    Agreed, personally I'd rather just accept ref's call but then Sky would fall over themselves to prove the ref is wrong.

    I don't recall Eric Clay back in the 60s sprinting up and down the field, he seemed to march up and down wearing his blazer and he could give a try from 25 yards away, there would be no point in arguing because you couldn't prove it one way or another

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    Going back to the idea of the Aussies taking over, if that happened would the restrictions on foreign players go.

    Would we want to end up like the Premier League in football where the top teams have got very few British players?

    It wouldn't be good for the national game but is that Super League's responsibility?

    Professional sport is in the entertainment business these days so as paying customers we want to watch the best.

    If you are film goer or enjoy going to concerts you don't restrict your choices to British artists only so should we do the same in sport?

    I'm playing devils advocate with the above comments, personally I do like watching local players come through the ranks but there is an argument that playing with Barba and Coote has brought the best out of Lomax.

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    Are there any arguments for keeping a salary cap in super league?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CGSaint View Post
    Are there any arguments for keeping a salary cap in super league?
    Probably the same argument premier league supporters have in regard to the premier league requiring some form of cap.
    Main problem for our sport would be attracting enough wealthy backers to make it competitive and sustainable or potentially become comparable to Wigan circa 1980s

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    I think the origin of this was a suggestion by Gus Gould. It seemed like a throw away suggestion to fill some TV time. So I am not sure how serious this is, unless someone actually has a link.

    The suggestion of Vulture Capitalists has been brought up by Elstone. As others have said, we are getting a one off payment for far more money in the future and all these people care about is making money. They don't care what the state of the sport is, and if things are going badly they will just do ANYTHING to recoup some cash. The only argument for it is if there was a plan for the money, such as a long term asset that would also make us a lot of money. However there is no evidence that there is a plan. Chances are the money will pay off old debt, keep struggling clubs going that will do bust in the next decade anyway, and pay Elstone's wages so he can retire before the s**t hits the fan.

    One benefit of some sort of group taking over is that in theory we would have one voice leading the elite level of the game. The idea of the SLE executive was to provided clear leadership, however it has just resulted in another voice shouting in a crowded room. The real solution is for one entity to own all the clubs, or at least the vital ones, if this results in one voice leading the game that would fix so many problems. If that was the NRL at least the goal would be the development of the game.
    I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noel Cleal View Post
    I think the origin of this was a suggestion by Gus Gould. It seemed like a throw away suggestion to fill some TV time. So I am not sure how serious this is, unless someone actually has a link.

    The suggestion of Vulture Capitalists has been brought up by Elstone. As others have said, we are getting a one off payment for far more money in the future and all these people care about is making money. They don't care what the state of the sport is, and if things are going badly they will just do ANYTHING to recoup some cash. The only argument for it is if there was a plan for the money, such as a long term asset that would also make us a lot of money. However there is no evidence that there is a plan. Chances are the money will pay off old debt, keep struggling clubs going that will do bust in the next decade anyway, and pay Elstone's wages so he can retire before the s**t hits the fan.

    One benefit of some sort of group taking over is that in theory we would have one voice leading the elite level of the game. The idea of the SLE executive was to provided clear leadership, however it has just resulted in another voice shouting in a crowded room. The real solution is for one entity to own all the clubs, or at least the vital ones, if this results in one voice leading the game that would fix so many problems. If that was the NRL at least the goal would be the development of the game.
    I don't want to see anyone else owning Saints, but I agree with the rest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noel Cleal View Post
    I think the origin of this was a suggestion by Gus Gould. It seemed like a throw away suggestion to fill some TV time. So I am not sure how serious this is, unless someone actually has a link.

    The suggestion of Vulture Capitalists has been brought up by Elstone. As others have said, we are getting a one off payment for far more money in the future and all these people care about is making money. [/B]The only argument for it is if there was a plan for the money, such as a long term asset that would also make us a lot of money. [/B]However there is no evidence that there is a plan. Chances are the money will pay off old debt, keep struggling clubs going that will do bust in the next decade anyway, and pay Elstone's wages so he can retire before the s**t hits the fan.

    One benefit of some sort of group taking over is that in theory we would have one voice leading the elite level of the game. The idea of the SLE executive was to provided clear leadership, however it has just resulted in another voice shouting in a crowded room. The real solution is for one entity to own all the clubs, or at least the vital ones, if this results in one voice leading the game that would fix so many problems. If that was the NRL at least the goal would be the development of the game.
    It depends which venture capitalists we get; I worked on a project with a supportive and interested group, who were prepared to take a lower return on their investment in order to realise a socially worthy project. But there are vultures in that game, too (no offence to real vultures, who perform vital tasks).

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    Quote Originally Posted by mufcsaint View Post
    Allso the chance even more third rate players will end up over here
    There is also the chance, if they view it as an expansion, that more internationals will come over knowing they won't jeapordise their chance at an Aussie call-up.

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    Won't the number of foreign players to a certain extent, be dictated by eligibility for work visas?

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    Wasnt sure which thread to copy this...

    Very well said by Jon Wilkin and I completely agree. Leaves a real bitter taste in the mouth, the inward looking superleague hierarchy.

    https://www.totalrl.com/weakest-perf...e-says-wilkin/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickles Forearm View Post
    Wasn’t sure which thread to copy this...

    Very well said by Jon Wilkin and I completely agree. Leaves a real bitter taste in the mouth, the inward looking superleague hierarchy.

    https://www.totalrl.com/weakest-perf...e-says-wilkin/
    The first part of the article is very good, but the latter part could coloured by his experience with Toronto, Either way good on him for coming out and saying it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickles Forearm View Post
    Wasn’t sure which thread to copy this...

    Very well said by Jon Wilkin and I completely agree. Leaves a real bitter taste in the mouth, the inward looking superleague hierarchy.

    https://www.totalrl.com/weakest-perf...e-says-wilkin/
    100% correct NF . The game in UK needs more young men like JW . Not old Yorkies who are only interested in feathering their own nests . Cannot wait to see if we get a reply from Cas & Wakie . Altho' I still think rugby league should be set up in Canada not individual teams allowed in S/L .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickles Forearm View Post
    Wasn’t sure which thread to copy this...

    Very well said by Jon Wilkin and I completely agree. Leaves a real bitter taste in the mouth, the inward looking superleague hierarchy.

    https://www.totalrl.com/weakest-perf...e-says-wilkin/
    Good on Jon for coming out and having the balls to say that. It won't win him many friends in West Yorkshire but I'm sure he knew that. He's only said what a lot of people think anyway, I'm glad someone has got the ball rolling and started questioning these joke clubs.

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    Just listened to the 5 live podcast. Elstone still talking about bringing Venture Capital into SL. He refused to answer or dodged around most questions. When asked about a broadcast partner he said he had been talking to at least 10 broadcast providers, and that those talks were continuing. He was then asked if the 2021 season would start in March. His response was "that is a good bet but they don't know what weekend as that will be up to Sky.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    Just listened to the 5 live podcast. Elstone still talking about bringing Venture Capital into SL. He refused to answer or dodged around most questions. When asked about a broadcast partner he said he had been talking to at least 10 broadcast providers, and that those talks were continuing. He was then asked if the 2021 season would start in March. His response was "that is a good bet but they don't know what weekend as that will be up to Sky.
    Every Evertonian I have spoken to hardly gave him a glowing reference
    Last edited by Ralph Fridge; 18th November 2020 at 21:59. Reason: Made porridge of using past and present tense.

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    Elstone is a knob beaten only by Kenwright they ruined the club. Major shareholder in The Bulls Fat Nige. Trying to do a deal over Odslum. Dark arts going on.

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