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Thread: Sky Commentary/Presentation

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    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk fishy3005's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sinkers89 View Post
    They was proper live.

    Couldnt fault it.
    The BBC commentary is much better than skys. Even Noble with his Australianisms like ‘spilled his lollies’ is much better than sky. I will never understand how Bill Arthur keeps getting work. He’s terrible. Almost everything he says, one way or another, is wrong. Is it so difficult to unearth a commentator who doesn’t make you want to cut off your own ears, shit on them, douse them in petrol, set them on fire, •••• on em, lock them in a box and throw them in the canal??
    screaming in the family corner, scaring the kiddies

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    The BBC commentary is much better than skys. Even Noble with his Australianisms like ‘spilled his lollies’ is much better than sky. I will never understand how Bill Arthur keeps getting work. He’s terrible. Almost everything he says, one way or another, is wrong. Is it so difficult to unearth a commentator who doesn’t make you want to cut off your own ears, shit on them, douse them in petrol, set them on fire, •••• on em, lock them in a box and throw them in the canal??
    I'm bitterly disappointed Sky has renewed with the RFL/Super League. At a time when Sky is seeking more than ever to make certain sports more fashionable and in vogue, what are we lumbered with? A presentation style that conforms to stereotype epitomised by two daft lads who are the modern day Eddie Waring. I'm more convinced that Gray was right - Sky just see the game as easy pickings that secures a decent chunk of subscribers but has neither the want nor inclination to do anything to help the sport expand on that. Its the quintessential schedule filler.

    How else could anyone explain that Bill Arthur, Stuart Pyke and to a lesser degree Ben Proe are all rolled out as the voice of the sport. The first two should barely be commentating on a local radio station let alone a national broadcaster. Do any of the super league clubs actually listen to or canvas the opinion of their fans? Does Elstone and his team? They'd get a pretty unanimous reaction: Sky is an awful look for the sport. Then we have the ridiculous try music (does anyone else think that's 'kool'?) which no self respecting sports fan would ever take seriously, the WWE style hyperbole and until fairly recently the robots on the enterance graphics. It would be laughable if it wasn't so damaging.

    The truth is rugby league has blagged this 'pioneering' image for years but it could'nt be further from the truth. There's a world of difference between calculated and careful experimentation and a reckless gambles that this sport takes. Most 'pioneering' has either been out of desperation (Toronto) or clearly at the behest of Sky who havwe used the sport as a lab-rat for its gimmicks and experiments for years. Proof is in the pudding as they say, and at the moment a bold decision was needed that would actually help the sport the game grabbed its carpet slippers and found the most snuggly comfort blanket it could find and nestled up to Sky.

    I'd love to hear Eamon's view on this and Saints. The sport means a lot to us; surely they can't see Sky as doing a good job with the sport

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I'm bitterly disappointed Sky has renewed with the RFL/Super League. At a time when Sky is seeking more than ever to make certain sports more fashionable and in vogue, what are we lumbered with? A presentation style that conforms to stereotype epitomised by two daft lads who are the modern day Eddie Waring. I'm more convinced that Gray was right - Sky just see the game as easy pickings that secures a decent chunk of subscribers but has neither the want nor inclination to do anything to help the sport expand on that. Its the quintessential schedule filler.

    How else could anyone explain that Bill Arthur, Stuart Pyke and to a lesser degree Ben Proe are all rolled out as the voice of the sport. The first two should barely be commentating on a local radio station let alone a national broadcaster. Do any of the super league clubs actually listen to their fans. Does Elstone and his team? They'd get a pretty unanimous reaction: Sky is an awful look for the sport. Then we have the ridiculous try music (does anyone else think that's 'kool'?) which no self respecting sports fan would ever take seriously, the WWE style hyperbole and until fairly recently the robots on the enterance graphics. It would be laughable if it wasn't so damaging.

    The truth is rugby league has blagged this 'pioneering' image for years but it could'nt be further from the truth. There's a world of difference between calculated and careful experimentation and a reckless gambles that this sport takes. Most 'pioneering' has either been out of desperation (Toronto) or clearly at the behest of Sky who havwe used the sport as a lab-rat for its gimmicks and experiments for years. Proof is in the pudding as they say, and at the moment a bold decision was needed that would actually help the sport the game grabbed its carpet slippers and found the most snuggly comfort blanket it could find and nestled up to Sky.

    I'd love to hear Eamon's view on this and Saints. The sport means a lot to us; surely they can't see Sky as doing a good job with the sport
    I think Eamon's private and public opinions would be very different. A case of don't bite the hand that feeds you, even if it's only a hand full of peanuts. The other thing being, he speaks out and you know it will end up costing us through the season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I'm bitterly disappointed Sky has renewed with the RFL/Super League. At a time when Sky is seeking more than ever to make certain sports more fashionable and in vogue, what are we lumbered with? A presentation style that conforms to stereotype epitomised by two daft lads who are the modern day Eddie Waring. I'm more convinced that Gray was right - Sky just see the game as easy pickings that secures a decent chunk of subscribers but has neither the want nor inclination to do anything to help the sport expand on that. Its the quintessential schedule filler.

    How else could anyone explain that Bill Arthur, Stuart Pyke and to a lesser degree Ben Proe are all rolled out as the voice of the sport. The first two should barely be commentating on a local radio station let alone a national broadcaster. Do any of the super league clubs actually listen to or canvas the opinion of their fans? Does Elstone and his team? They'd get a pretty unanimous reaction: Sky is an awful look for the sport. Then we have the ridiculous try music (does anyone else think that's 'kool'?) which no self respecting sports fan would ever take seriously, the WWE style hyperbole and until fairly recently the robots on the enterance graphics. It would be laughable if it wasn't so damaging.

    The truth is rugby league has blagged this 'pioneering' image for years but it could'nt be further from the truth. There's a world of difference between calculated and careful experimentation and a reckless gambles that this sport takes. Most 'pioneering' has either been out of desperation (Toronto) or clearly at the behest of Sky who havwe used the sport as a lab-rat for its gimmicks and experiments for years. Proof is in the pudding as they say, and at the moment a bold decision was needed that would actually help the sport the game grabbed its carpet slippers and found the most snuggly comfort blanket it could find and nestled up to Sky.

    I'd love to hear Eamon's view on this and Saints. The sport means a lot to us; surely they can't see Sky as doing a good job with the sport
    Thank you, Its not only me then. They are ruining the sport.

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    I hate the music they put on after a try is scored!

    The music and the idea is a throwback to the 90's! Im sure Monday Night Football on sky used to do it back then.

    I dont have an issue with sky owning the rights. Its a massive company and is good for the sport. But it needs a revamp desperately.

    Too many voices. Too many Ex Wigan / Leeds players.

    I cant stand Brian Carney, he is always tripping over his words.

    Baz and Terry , one there own are fine, together they seem to play top trumps in old rugby storys.

    Bill Arthur is nothing short of awful.

    Welsbys try deserved better thab the sound of someone losing a bet and then trying to imply Frenchs foot was Welsbys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sinkers89 View Post
    I hate the music they put on after a try is scored!

    The music and the idea is a throwback to the 90's! Im sure Monday Night Football on sky used to do it back then.

    I dont have an issue with sky owning the rights. Its a massive company and is good for the sport. But it needs a revamp desperately.

    Too many voices. Too many Ex Wigan / Leeds players.

    I cant stand Brian Carney, he is always tripping over his words.

    Baz and Terry , one there own are fine, together they seem to play top trumps in old rugby storys.

    Bill Arthur is nothing short of awful.

    Welsbys try deserved better thab the sound of someone losing a bet and then trying to imply Frenchs foot was Welsbys.
    Honestly if you got rid of every single one of them I wouldn’t complain.

    I’d revamp the way it’s organised.

    1) Have a commentary team with one out and out commentator along with an ex pro beside them like pretty much every other sport does. Too many voices in the commentary box at the moment.

    2) Studio team hosted by 1 person with 2 current/ex players or coaches to analyse the game.

    3) One pitch side reporter for injury updates, player interviews etc

    4) One analyst who they can go over to during breaks in play, half time and full time.

    The main commentator is the big one though. To get across the excitement of a moment you need a voice that still sounds good while shouting. It’s a fine art and I bet if we all recorded ourselves doing the wide to west commentary and listening back it would sound awful. I didn’t always agree with Eddie Hemmings’ opinions but as a commentator of the game itself he was excellent and we really miss him.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    Honestly if you got rid of every single one of them I wouldn’t complain.

    I’d revamp the way it’s organised.

    1) Have a commentary team with one out and out commentator along with an ex pro beside them like pretty much every other sport does. Too many voices in the commentary box at the moment.

    2) Studio team hosted by 1 person with 2 current/ex players or coaches to analyse the game.

    3) One pitch side reporter for injury updates, player interviews etc

    4) One analyst who they can go over to during breaks in play, half time and full time.

    The main commentator is the big one though. To get across the excitement of a moment you need a voice that still sounds good while shouting. It’s a fine art and I bet if we all recorded ourselves doing the wide to west commentary and listening back it would sound awful. I didn’t always agree with Eddie Hemmings’ opinions but as a commentator of the game itself he was excellent and we really miss him.
    Agree with all of that

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    So what are the realistic alternatives to Sky? Presumably Elstone has been sounding out alternative broadcasters but has found no viable option to provide sufficient funds to support a game that is largely struggling financially. If this is the case, I doubt that the opinions of viewers will count for much unless they cancel their subscriptions and make the reasons clear to Sky. This will either make Sky change things or pull out of the sport downstream if income fails to meet costs.

    As far as the actual coverage is concerned, I find I can tolerate the commentary (often thinking that post match complaints of bias on here are unfounded) and have never really noticed the background music during try replays. That’s not to say that I can’t see room for improvement but I don’t think BBC is the answer, finding Noble and Davies equally as shallow but more outdated as their Sky equivalents. I also think that the BBC focus on replays to the detriment of live action is unpardonable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    So what are the realistic alternatives to Sky? Presumably Elstone has been sounding out alternative broadcasters but has found no viable option to provide sufficient funds to support a game that is largely struggling financially. If this is the case, I doubt that the opinions of viewers will count for much unless they cancel their subscriptions and make the reasons clear to Sky. This will either make Sky change things or pull out of the sport downstream if income fails to meet costs.

    As far as the actual coverage is concerned, I find I can tolerate the commentary (often thinking that post match complaints of bias on here are unfounded) and have never really noticed the background music during try replays. That’s not to say that I can’t see room for improvement but I don’t think BBC is the answer, finding Noble and Davies equally as shallow but more outdated as their Sky equivalents. I also think that the BBC focus on replays to the detriment of live action is unpardonable.
    The only example I can give is how the International Rugby Union is produced and shown on sky.

    Its very simplistic, its clean and tidy. It looks professional. Most people on there have their heads screwed on properly as well.

    It needs streamlining and modernising. Nothing to unrealistic to ask for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sinkers89 View Post
    The only example I can give is how the International Rugby Union is produced and shown on sky.

    Its very simplistic, its clean and tidy. It looks professional. Most people on there have their heads screwed on properly as well.

    It needs streamlining and modernising. Nothing to unrealistic to ask for.
    Agreed in principle but I suspect you’ll find thousands of union fans that can’t stand Stuart Barnes as part of the commentary team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    So what are the realistic alternatives to Sky? Presumably Elstone has been sounding out alternative broadcasters but has found no viable option to provide sufficient funds to support a game that is largely struggling financially. If this is the case, I doubt that the opinions of viewers will count for much unless they cancel their subscriptions and make the reasons clear to Sky. This will either make Sky change things or pull out of the sport downstream if income fails to meet costs.

    As far as the actual coverage is concerned, I find I can tolerate the commentary (often thinking that post match complaints of bias on here are unfounded) and have never really noticed the background music during try replays. That’s not to say that I can’t see room for improvement but I don’t think BBC is the answer, finding Noble and Davies equally as shallow but more outdated as their Sky equivalents. I also think that the BBC focus on replays to the detriment of live action is unpardonable.
    I believe BT came in with a last minute, serious offer but we should'nt be limiting ourselves to just the broadcasters with the growth of streaming as an alternative IMO. Irrespective, SKY have been allowed way to much influence in the direction of the sport which is ironic given their coverage is so poor. This isn't healthy for any sport but its a sign of the low regard in which the sport holds itself and the relative state of the game.

    Any sport that needs to grow like RL should be clear on its expectations of how it should be presented. Try music based on acid house from 1991 isn't the direction and any sort of music accompanying play belongs squarely back in that age; its totally laughable (or astonishing) that any serious broadcaster thinks this is 'down with the kids.' The choice of Arthur as main commentator was as 'comfort shoes' as it gets. Where was the ambition? These jobs are difficult and it should have been a case of 'sorry Bill but you just are'nt cut out for this.'

    I disagree on the BBC; they do most things right and are a step in the right direction. I know some people are'nt fond on Woods but he's a damn sight better than Arthur and Mark Chapman is everything an anchor man should be in this day and age - reasoned, balanced and calm not like Wells and Carney who seem to think that the only way to get heard is to shout and talk as frantically as possible. I don't mind Davies who does'nt pander to the 'everything needs to be sensational' script. If its rubbish, call it! Again its ironic given I remember the times when people hammered the BBC for its portrayal of the sport.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    The main commentator is the big one though. To get across the excitement of a moment you need a voice that still sounds good while shouting. It’s a fine art and I bet if we all recorded ourselves doing the wide to west commentary and listening back it would sound awful. I didn’t always agree with Eddie Hemmings’ opinions but as a commentator of the game itself he was excellent and we really miss him.
    This is spot on. People talk about commentating like it's easy.

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    Grand Final had an average rating of 374,000 on Main Event and Arena (181, 193 respectively). Pretty average rating given that about 60,000 of them would have normally been at the game.

    The alternative was BT, who were interested. If we'd have had similar style of coverage as they do for the Prem RU we'd have been in a happier place. Two main reasons... They seem to have a better relationship with the BBC and we could have seen more crossover of pundits instead of just having the odd one like Wilkin amidst the Sky lot. And secondly, they seem a lot happier sharing content with free TV, as seen by Channel 5 having five live games per season and freedom about where they stick their weekly highlights show. To have a better free highlights show on a Sunday evening (for example) and a free channel showing five live games of their choosing (Good Friday, one game from MW, etc) combined with a better overall presentation from BT would have done us a lot of favours.

    The flip side is that if we break from Sky they may never come back. Maybe BT Sports isn't a thing in 5-10 years, maybe the ditch us after 3 years etc. Then what happens if Sky have washed their hands of us? So I understand the concern about breaking the 'partnership' but I'd still have done it.

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    I will add that in the modern climate the primary rights holders aren’t the be all and end all when it come to coverage in most sports. You can follow the PL without Sky to some extent (MOTD, BT have games, Amazon have games etc), you can follow test cricket in the summer without Sky as there are highlights every evening on BBC2 and the BBC website has clips of the main action all day, and you can follow club RU without having BT Sports because C5 have some live games and have a nationally televised weekly highlights show. The thing these days is to give secondary rights holders enough to make sure that those that don’t want or can’t afford to pay for the primary rights holders content can still follow the leagues.

    In RL we really fail in that regard. People up here have to wait until nearly midnight on Monday to get the Super League Show, which is scheduled closer to the start of the next round of games than the start of the one it’s showing highlights of. What worth are highlights of a big Thursday night game 4 days later? And those outside the NW have to wait until Tuesday afternoon to see it. That is absurd in this day and age. The amount of money a secondary rights holder would have to pay to show a handful of live SL games and have a national highlights show at a decent time every weekend wouldn’t be massive, but Sky are preventing any of it happening. BT have always been more open to doing this, allowing the RU Prem to have good free coverage, sticking the CL Final on YouTube for free when they didn’t have to, etc. Super League clubs could have asked for the same thing and allowed more people access to our sport.

    If we’re pulling in less than 400,000 for a Friday night Grand Final between the two biggest rivals in our sport in a lockdown with no fans able to go to the game are we realising our potential? What would it have been if people were off doing other stuff as normal and 60,000 were at OT? 250,000? Hardly a ringing endorsement eh.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    Agreed in principle but I suspect you’ll find thousands of union fans that can’t stand Stuart Barnes as part of the commentary team.
    Yes Barnes talks absolute Tripe. But that was the part I was talking about when I said "most people"

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    There seemed to be very little build up on SKY re the GF. In previous years we've had at least a half hour programme prior to the day itself looking at the squads, how they got there, interviews etc, etc There appeared to be no promotion whatsoever (apologies if I missed it). The sport is a great product and the final itself was the stuff a broadcaster dreams of, but due to lack of promotion very few actually saw it unfold "live". SKY apart from needing to get rid of Baz and Tez and let the commentator commentate need to update the whole look of the show. Indeed the most disappointing thing in the final was the commentator desperately attempting to find fault with the winning try, he should have been in ecstasy, as should anyone who wasn't a Wigan fan or Saints hater!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post

    If we’re pulling in less than 400,000 for a Friday night Grand Final between the two biggest rivals in our sport in a lockdown with no fans able to go to the game are we realising our potential? What would it have been if people were off doing other stuff as normal and 60,000 were at OT? 250,000? Hardly a ringing endorsement eh.
    The only thing those numbers seem to endorse is the fact that rugby league is a parochial, minority sport, hence its low value in the eyes of broadcasters. And that after any effort that has been expended by Elstone and his team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    The only thing those numbers seem to endorse is the fact that rugby league is a parochial, minority sport, hence its low value in the eyes of broadcasters. And that after any effort that has been expended by Elstone and his team.
    So do we want a broadcaster that reinforces that or one that may help to spread the game?

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    The BBC commentary is much better than skys. Even Noble with his Australianisms like ‘spilled his lollies’ is much better than sky. I will never understand how Bill Arthur keeps getting work. He’s terrible. Almost everything he says, one way or another, is wrong. Is it so difficult to unearth a commentator who doesn’t make you want to cut off your own ears, shit on them, douse them in petrol, set them on fire, •••• on em, lock them in a box and throw them in the canal??
    I missed this originally, but yeah Noble is totally cringeworthy with cheesy Australianisms: money ball, great D, smart reads, real tough (since when did really become insufficent?) etc. Its like the game has become a pale imitation of the NRL at every level. Pathetic.

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    Just a little bit of perspective as to the game through the eyes of others, one of the suppliers I use has a chap of similar vintage to myself who asked where I was from many years ago. He regularly mentions the games to me knew who Meninga was and how he thought our game was fantastic, most of last week he was mentioning a final that is a derby, we must win etc, a few others were jeering and general banter. On Monday to a man they all thought the game was a borefest and most switched over before half time, the one that didn`t fell asleep. I think we have the best sport, many disagree.
    Gray we had this discussion on the reality of deals a few months ago, we thought 100,000 customers at a tenner a month would be achievable and that gives us 12 million, 28 million short of what Sky pay. It is grim reading.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallaght Tiger View Post
    Just a little bit of perspective as to the game through the eyes of others, one of the suppliers I use has a chap of similar vintage to myself who asked where I was from many years ago. He regularly mentions the games to me knew who Meninga was and how he thought our game was fantastic, most of last week he was mentioning a final that is a derby, we must win etc, a few others were jeering and general banter. On Monday to a man they all thought the game was a borefest and most switched over before half time, the one that didn`t fell asleep. I think we have the best sport, many disagree.
    Gray we had this discussion on the reality of deals a few months ago, we thought 100,000 customers at a tenner a month would be achievable and that gives us 12 million, 28 million short of what Sky pay. It is grim reading.
    Tallaght - for all the game was tenacious and aggressive there was if we are being honest a lack of game opening halves on either side or inclination to take any sort of risk. You could see a conservative game plan on both sides and this was reflected by the lack of options off any of the game players and the decisions to hit easy runners most sets. This does'nt mean the game was poor; the defence was a brutal as I remember but it was a noticeable missing IMO.
    he game here has become template with kicks to boxes, exit sets and 4th tackle drop offs the norm. I can see your mate's point of view in that regard. Football had its uber-boring 4-5-1 days in the early 00's maybe we are having our equivalent? At least you have AD's top tips to keep you entertained though....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    you’ll find thousands of union fans that can’t stand Stuart Barnes.
    Something I can finally agree with rah-rah fans about

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    Tallaght - for all the game was tenacious and aggressive there was if we are being honest a lack of game opening halves on either side or inclination to take any sort of risk. You could see a conservative game plan on both sides and this was reflected by the lack of options off any of the game players and the decisions to hit easy runners most sets. This does'nt mean the game was poor; the defence was a brutal as I remember but it was a noticeable missing IMO.
    he game here has become template with kicks to boxes, exit sets and 4th tackle drop offs the norm. I can see your mate's point of view in that regard. Football had its uber-boring 4-5-1 days in the early 00's maybe we are having our equivalent? At least you have AD's top tips to keep you entertained though....
    He kept them to himself this week posted he was staying clear.
    The only time I sit in front of the TV is to watch RL and I enjoy all aspects of it, I gained as much pleasure from that game as a scorefest, in fact the last game I can remember us being in a match that intense was the Leeds playoff 2007 think it was 12-10 for us.
    We are supporters of our sport, connoisseurs if you like, sadly the neutral does not view it that way and neither does most of the paying public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I missed this originally, but yeah Noble is totally cringeworthy with cheesy Australianisms: money ball, great D, smart reads, real tough (since when did really become insufficent?) etc. Its like the game has become a pale imitation of the NRL at every level. Pathetic.
    If he uses the term 'eluded to it earlier' once he eludes to it a thousand times.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I missed this originally, but yeah Noble is totally cringeworthy with cheesy Australianisms: money ball, great D, smart reads, real tough (since when did really become insufficent?) etc. Its like the game has become a pale imitation of the NRL at every level. Pathetic.
    You forgot his favourite ‘he’s into the backfield’ cringe
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