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Thread: Mr Woolf Advice

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    Default Mr Woolf Advice

    After the abysmal display in our last league match v's Castleford what does Mr Woolf need to do for season start?

    1. Getting everyone fit will be a start for him.
    2. Watch the open style of play from last year and stop the wrestle tactics that are killing us with penalty's this year?

    Anymore?

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    Learning All The Songs Angry Dave's Avatar
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    Fitness wise we should be alright, obviously the players haven't trained properly for a number of weeks so we're basically starting again in that respect but so is everyone else. It's only Percival to my knowledge who's out should we return next month. Regarding his replacement, Welsby isn't the answer, neither is Costello, he just isn't good enough, that leaves either Bentley or Josh Simm, I'd like to see Simm given a chance but I don't think Woolfe will go that way.

    Having Coote back should hopefully help our attacking shape, and Roby having an extended rest should also be a bonus, that could be one of the big saving graces of this lock down. Also playing in better weather on harder pitches should suit us. I'd also like to see him be a bit more decisive when changes need to be made but again, I don't hold much hope.

    I think we need to have a clean slate scenario but if he doesn't change things, peoples patience will quickly run low. I think I probably speak for a lot of people in that we're all looking for something positive right now and RL returning will give that, but equally we don't want to be let down.

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    Lets be honest, he's a dead man walking. He just doesn't get it, it's a complete write off. From the rumours the players and staff already at the club don't buy into his philosophies either, so he has very little chance of turning it around.

    Cunningham MKII. Now we need to be looking for Holbrook MKII.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rommel View Post
    After the abysmal display in our last league match v's Castleford what does Mr Woolf need to do for season start?

    1. Getting everyone fit will be a start for him.
    2. Watch the open style of play from last year and stop the wrestle tactics that are killing us with penalty's this year?

    Anymore?
    I agree, obviously a level playing field for everyone, the first few matches, if they do finally get the go ahead , are going to be strange as none of the players have had any sort of man on man training sessions or grappling practice hurrah! The club's will be so desperate to start playing that any sort of "pre season" preparation will be out of the window, I reckon there will be quite a lot of missed tackles and a more open game, I hope players like Lomax take the game by the scruff of the neck and just play their natural game and ignore messages from the touchline, also a few of the players who are naturally not good trainers, especially if they've been on their own will be quickly found out. The use of subs will be even more important. Under the new normal way of life, Rugby Union are contemplating some sort of game without competetive scrums, both structured and loose in lower leagues, I think it's called Rugby League

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    Lets be honest, he's a dead man walking. He just doesn't get it, it's a complete write off. From the rumours the players and staff already at the club don't buy into his philosophies either, so he has very little chance of turning it around.

    Cunningham MKII. Now we need to be looking for Holbrook MKII.
    I was trying to find some positives ya mizzo, but you're probably right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    Lets be honest, he's a dead man walking. He just doesn't get it, it's a complete write off. From the rumours the players and staff already at the club don't buy into his philosophies either, so he has very little chance of turning it around.

    Cunningham MKII. Now we need to be looking for Holbrook MKII.
    I think he will be given time. But, it's so hit and miss when you go for an Aussie assistant to step up. if he has lost the dressing room he either needs to change his ideas fast or we should be looking toward Manchester for our next coach. Go for a proven SL coach that has never had the resources we provide. Apparently Watson was in the last two to replace JH anyway so for me it would be an easy choice.

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    Im struggling to see what happens. He seems a bad fit for us. Even if he attempts to change its not in his dna, hell always have a get out clause like well you told me to play like that or something similar.

    Id support releasing him and trying to sort something out, season is in chaos now anyway so not too bothered to be honest.

    Oh & play players in position utilising the whole squad as necessary is a pre-requisite for any coach, him included.


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    He’ll be given time obviously, because the situation now means he won’t be judged by what happens in 2020 as it’ll be written off as an abnormal year regardless. The club will judge him in 2021 if we hopefully get back to normal.

    Unfortunately that means we won’t rectify the negative changes that he has brought in until 2022. People on here defended KC in the first six months and demanded that we give him time. Because he was a legend, and because we are a big club that shouldn’t make knee jerk decisions we all gave him time, and our willingness to give him time and act like a fanbase that didn’t hound a fella out meant we went backwards and wasted two years.

    I’m sure the same people will advocate giving Woolf the same time and will advise us to be patient, which we probably will be. Whoever we bring in in 2022 to rectify this will have an even bigger job than Holbrook because we’ll likely have less money and will have a weaker squad by then.

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    I don't understand though after the KC debacle EM should know better than anyone and what a different place the club was under Holbrook in every way.
    I wonder did we or should we have stipulated this is St Helens way of playing and that only a coach willing to continue that should apply?. I know coaches don't work like that but still we needed a continuation of what was happening.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    Lets be honest, he's a dead man walking. He just doesn't get it, it's a complete write off. From the rumours the players and staff already at the club don't buy into his philosophies either, so he has very little chance of turning it around.

    Cunningham MKII. Now we need to be looking for Holbrook MKII.
    Is this accurate or conjecture based on our performances?

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    On the podcast McManus talks about Kristian Woolf and how he hasn't got an easy start to the season, I thought we only had a couple of players going through recovery but McManus mentions half the team were unfit and Woolf was unable to get the team playing like we did at the end of the last season. That tells me our chairman is showing a bit more tolerance and is waiting until the team can fire on all guns, with everything up in the air it's going to be a long time until we get to that point.

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    Early signs aren’t altogether promising but I think you can only judge him judge him with Percival and Coote playing. I know managing injuries is part of his job but our season never really got started with the disruption to the team

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Newlove View Post
    I wonder did we or should we have stipulated this is St Helens way of playing and that only a coach willing to continue that should apply?. I know coaches don't work like that but still we needed a continuation of what was happening.
    I don't think any coach should be asked to change their philosophy to suit an individual club, because especially in a game like RL where coaches move around alot you would end up with coaches having to alter their gameplan every 2 years. Also, how do coaches ever make their name if they are just thought of as diluting their natural instincts to suit their present role?

    Instead, the reality is that clubs should only look at coaches who have a track record of playing a certain way, or have indicated their preference for it. If a club wants quick results and success at any costs then the net is cast far wider, but if the aim is to have a coach that tells his players to express themselves then you look at certain types of coaches, and in reality they aren't that hard to find.

    There is obviously no way we should have even been looking for a 'results at any cost' coach after we have basically dominated the comp for 2 seasons. The only thing we lacked was a big game mentality, which we got out of our system at OT. Everything was in place. The aim should have been to build from what Holbrook did and maintaining our place at the top of the tree. Tweaks and changes are natural, but it looks like Woolf has decided to rip it up and turn us into a mock NRL team to try and impress potential suitors in Australia. As a result, we are worse to watch and have also lost as many times in 6 games as we lost all last season in the league.

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    OK I get what you're saying maybe I didn't phrase my point right but I'm basically agreeing with you it's the job of the club to appoint the right man that fits what the owner and fans want to see on the field.
    I'm not expecting a coach to change his philosophy but we should be 100% sure their style is what we are after

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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    On the podcast McManus talks about Kristian Woolf and how he hasn't got an easy start to the season, I thought we only had a couple of players going through recovery but McManus mentions half the team were unfit and Woolf was unable to get the team playing like we did at the end of the last season. That tells me our chairman is showing a bit more tolerance and is waiting until the team can fire on all guns, with everything up in the air it's going to be a long time until we get to that point.

    I will give him time but I'm not massively hopeful that it will work out.
    Dave Woods: the guy who makes Eddie Hemmings look like a decent commentator

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I will give him time but I'm not massively hopeful that it will work out.
    Same here, mainly because there is clear evidence our attacking structure is nowhere near good enough even taking into account players missing or players recovering.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I will give him time but I'm not massively hopeful that it will work out.
    Agree with this but I know my patience won't last long.

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    Default Mr Woolf Advice

    As much as the buck stops with Woolfe and his tactics and decisions havent been good enough. The effort, intensity and desire from the players against Cas was a long way short of what we expect from this group.

    Hopefully this time off has given everyone the kick up the arse that they need.


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    The lockdown and premature halt to the season could be a blessing for us. The likes of Roby, Knowles and Makinson didn't have a pre season so started the season on the backfoot and the early season injuries affected the balance of the side.

    I don't see SL returning until July at best with all sides probably back in training 3 weeks earlier so that will give the players a pre season and every team starting at the same level again rather than us playing catch up. It'll be important for the coaching staff, conditioners and players to make the most of that period and get themselves in great shape for the rest of the season. Percival probably won't be far off a return either and he'll be a big boost for us as that left Centre position was problematic (assume Bentley will step in in Percy's absence).

    It hasn't been a great start to the season but the WCC performance was good, so the players are capable of delivering, they just need to show that kind of level more often.

    We'll see what happens once the season restarts and whether we improve under Woolf or not after an average start.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blobbynator View Post
    The lockdown and premature halt to the season could be a blessing for us. The likes of Roby, Knowles and Makinson didn't have a pre season so started the season on the backfoot and the early season injuries affected the balance of the side.

    I don't see SL returning until July at best with all sides probably back in training 3 weeks earlier so that will give the players a pre season and every team starting at the same level again rather than us playing catch up. It'll be important for the coaching staff, conditioners and players to make the most of that period and get themselves in great shape for the rest of the season. Percival probably won't be far off a return either and he'll be a big boost for us as that left Centre position was problematic (assume Bentley will step in in Percy's absence).

    It hasn't been a great start to the season but the WCC performance was good, so the players are capable of delivering, they just need to show that kind of level more often.

    We'll see what happens once the season restarts and whether we improve under Woolf or not after an average start.
    Agree with all that.

    However ,what was dished up to start, might be subject to some mitigation, there does needs to be more offloads and flair and less MMA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Weetabix View Post
    Is this accurate or conjecture based on our performances?
    I have no idea. I just hear the rumours everyone else hears. I certainly don't have any inside sources.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    Lets be honest, he's a dead man walking. He just doesn't get it, it's a complete write off. From the rumours the players and staff already at the club don't buy into his philosophies either, so he has very little chance of turning it around.

    No one i've spoke to is impressed with him as you he seems to Cunningham mark2
    Cunningham MKII. Now we need to be looking for Holbrook MKII.

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    FFS get a grip people.
    Learned comment from The Don

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    I have no idea. I just hear the rumours everyone else hears. I certainly don't have any inside sources.
    Sounds made up.

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    I had a dream last night that we were playing Portsmouth in a field somewhere, and we lost too them. Their tries were from kick through’s and our performance was shocking. So after that defeat im afraid he has to go.

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