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    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk DD's Avatar
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    Default Coronavirus - Rugby League Implications

    As the other thread now seems to have migrated into a discussion about the virus and the wider health and political implications, I thought I'd kick off one about the effects on the game and keep the two separate.

    I think we are now beyond the point of thinking that we are going to be able to come out of the house in June and start watching rugby again. This is simply not going to happen. When you consider that Germany, a country that has kept the number of fatalities to a much lower level than here, has said that there will be no gatherings at sporting fixtures before September at the very earliest, then there is no reason to suspect that date is going to be improved upon here.

    Given that the current season had only just got underway, unlike football, curtailing the season will not cause the same moral issues in terms of promotion, relegation and title races. Indeed, given the struggles of Toronto, it could well save the game a dilemma in that respect.

    For me, I see no hope of sport being back on the menu soon and I actually don't really think we are going to see crowds over a few hundred at sporting fixtures back for another 12 months. I might be wrong. I hope I'm wrong, but I really think the public is being kept from the truth of the likely extent of the social distancing that will need to be kept in place for fear of social unrest. Given that the virus will not be killed off, it seems implausible that we can even think of mass gatherings throughout the winter months when the virus will still be circulating, at least until the elderly and vulnerable have access to vaccination.

    On that basis, I cannot see past the season being abandoned completely, even if the RFL wish to carry on for the moment in the stubborn belief that it won't be.

    However, it would be feasible perhaps to play out a convoluted season behind closed doors, as social distancing gets relaxed to allow small gatherings.

    So, would it be morally right to get games underway in late summer and play some behind closed doors, and would that have any positive financial benefit via Sky TV?

    Can any club realistically survive 12 months without playing?

    Quite frankly, where do we go from here? How does the game get out of this situation?

    Obviously, I am aware there are more important things than rugby at the moment, but we all need to keep the grey matter alert.
    THIS YEAR LENDING SUPPORT TO:- St. Helens RLFC, Manchester City, Celtic, Alemannia Aachen, Steps 1 to 6 Non-League Football

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    In The South Stand KentishBarry's Avatar
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    Televised games behind closed doors is an obvious way forward as restrictions are gradually lifted.
    Trouble is, I'm not sure how far they would need to be lifted before it's acceptable to have two teams plus all the necessary support staff breaking the 2m distance thing (which they will have to do). Maybe, if the testing takes off as it should do, games could be played only using players showing immunity?
    Games need a doctor and other emergency cover on hand, so that could be problematic if they are as busy as they are now!

    Can clubs survive? I think most will. A struggling club can probably get more financial help now than would have been available a year or two ago.
    I've said on other threads that I would like to see the RFL state that they will not punish any club having to enter administration.

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    Economically the wider game will need either support from the Government or the Broadcaster. Saints have got a stadium built to generate off-field growth to sustain the rugby that we all love. At present plenty of outgoings but no or minimal income. Can we sustain a lost twelve months on both strands of the business heaven knows.

    Looking at Salford I don't know how they would come back as a professional club from a 12 month break without serious external support.

    The teams who live hand to mouth in the part-time element of the sport on traditional low spec owned stadia for example Keighley maybe nothing changes and they just get back on the horse when it runs again.

    The wider sport and the conflicting Governing bodies the RFL and SLE will really feel this break especially the RFL who in my time of dealing with them had a large organisational headcount and as was evidenced by his pay-off Nige was on a fat wedge. I know they may furlough staff but any Government hand out will no doubt be looked upon by the RFL as partly theirs.

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    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk STIDDY's Avatar
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    There is a far bigger picture than just looking at Rugby League in isolation, there will be a pivot point after 3 months of lock down when they need to get the Economy powered up again to avoid a total collapse in more ways than one. I don't think any business sport would survive a 12 month break, the government will have a pecking order of support with services and manufacturing at the top of the list, Rugby League will have very little value especially when the government funding drys up.

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    In The South Stand Paul Newlove's Avatar
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    Unfortunately if this season doesn't happen I can see all RL players being made redundant and becoming free agents. Some could go to NRL some to Union (although they are struggling also). Super League may come back completely different, part time?, different squads?
    I obviously hope I'm wrong and we can restart the season at some point but RL clubs can't keep players with no income.

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    Got A Season Ticket singe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Newlove View Post
    Unfortunately if this season doesn't happen I can see all RL players being made redundant and becoming free agents. Some could go to NRL some to Union (although they are struggling also). Super League may come back completely different, part time?, different squads?
    I obviously hope I'm wrong and we can restart the season at some point but RL clubs can't keep players with no income.
    Can't see too many heading this way to be honest. There's still talk here of a couple of clubs not making it through in the NRL. That would mean a surplus of players and little room for extras.

    As an aside - happy 90th birthday to my mum in St Helens. Should have been over there celebrating today. If anyone walks past the corner of Kiln Lane and Millbrook Lane, yell out Happy 90th for me, would you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    There is a far bigger picture than just looking at Rugby League in isolation, there will be a pivot point after 3 months of lock down when they need to get the Economy powered up again to avoid a total collapse in more ways than one. I don't think any business sport would survive a 12 month break, the government will have a pecking order of support with services and manufacturing at the top of the list, Rugby League will have very little value especially when the government funding drys up.
    At which point the yanks will no doubt kick off another war, most likely in Iraq I'd say, especially as them and the Saudi's seem to be reaching an agreement on oil output at the moment. Generate some quick cash, do the whole infastructure thing through government contractors again and bang oil prices back up. I best dig out my bucket and spade.

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    In The South Stand Sean Day's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyprus View Post
    Economically the wider game will need either support from the Government or the Broadcaster. Saints have got a stadium built to generate off-field growth to sustain the rugby that we all love. At present plenty of outgoings but no or minimal income. Can we sustain a lost twelve months on both strands of the business heaven knows.

    Looking at Salford I don't know how they would come back as a professional club from a 12 month break without serious external support.

    The teams who live hand to mouth in the part-time element of the sport on traditional low spec owned stadia for example Keighley maybe nothing changes and they just get back on the horse when it runs again.

    The wider sport and the conflicting Governing bodies the RFL and SLE will really feel this break especially the RFL who in my time of dealing with them had a large organisational headcount and as was evidenced by his pay-off Nige was on a fat wedge. I know they may furlough staff but any Government hand out will no doubt be looked upon by the RFL as partly theirs.
    I was reading an article the other day that said clubs like Salford are in a reasonable position to survive as they rent a ground and have a relatively low cost base with a budget squad and minimal off field staffing.

    On the wider issue I think the only hope for the season is the behind closed doors approach and possibly 30 mins each way if there needs to be multiple games per week. All of this only possible with social distancing being relaxed. It might be a good idea for SL/RFL to give away games for free to give the game a bit more exposure and advertising revenue to cover the loss in other revenue streams like gate money and hospitality

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    In The South Stand KentishBarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    I was reading an article the other day that said clubs like Salford are in a reasonable position to survive as they rent a ground and have a relatively low cost base with a budget squad and minimal off field staffing...
    I was thinking about those who rent (mentioning no names). It could also end in tears if the organisation you're renting from went bust!

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    In The West Stand Ralph Fridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    I was reading an article the other day that said clubs like Salford are in a reasonable position to survive as they rent a ground and have a relatively low cost base with a budget squad and minimal off field staffing.

    On the wider issue I think the only hope for the season is the behind closed doors approach and possibly 30 mins each way if there needs to be multiple games per week. All of this only possible with social distancing being relaxed. It might be a good idea for SL/RFL to give away games for free to give the game a bit more exposure and advertising revenue to cover the loss in other revenue streams like gate money and hospitality
    You're right. The likes of us, Warrington, Leeds, possibly Hull & Wigan with relatively high wage bills are going to struggle. Catalans are going to be hit very hard I think too.

    Edit: Warrington do have an owner with serious money behind him so if he's prepared to dig into his coffers, they'll be alright

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    Warrington do have an owner with serious money behind him so if he's prepared to dig into his coffers, they'll be alright
    This is true, but my thoughts always lead me to the question 'will you spend the money to survive if you have no idea what will be left at the end of it all?'. Will anyone spend a seven figure sum to keep their club going when the rest of the sport is going under? You could end up with 4 or 5 owners or CEOs spending millions to end up as the only clubs that can survive as fully professional. In that respect, you would imagine that they will be taking advice and looking at the long term viability of their investments if we are all still socially distancing and barred from going to games in 3 months time.

    I have no idea what will happen here, but in a doomsday scenario I would rather have 15-20 RL clubs in England able to compete at a semi-professional level than have 4-5 reasonably strong professional clubs and the rest going out of business or being primarily amateur.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    You're right. The likes of us, Warrington, Leeds, possibly Hull & Wigan with relatively high wage bills are going to struggle. Catalans are going to be hit very hard I think too.

    Edit: Warrington do have an owner with serious money behind him so if he's prepared to dig into his coffers, they'll be alright
    The other thing to consider if this goes on for 12 months is those high wage bills might come down because there will be a lot of players off contract toward the end of this current season. I would imagine quite a fair percentage will be overseas players who may never chance the return to the UK, could we manage without Coote, Tai, Peyroux, Naiqama and Paulo the answer might be yes for us but I,m not sure if other teams would, in particularly Hull who could be in deep trouble.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    You're right. The likes of us, Warrington, Leeds, possibly Hull & Wigan with relatively high wage bills are going to struggle. Catalans are going to be hit very hard I think too.

    Edit: Warrington do have an owner with serious money behind him so if he's prepared to dig into his coffers, they'll be alright
    Can a rich owner just pile funds in?

    I'm not too sure but doesn't your salary cap have to be a percentage of your club's income.

    He could carry the other debts of the club but I don't think he can fund player's wages.

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    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk paulscnthorpe's Avatar
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    Interesting they are looking to see if sky will cover every game with a pay per view option such a season ticket for each team if large gatherings are banned still

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulscnthorpe View Post
    Interesting they are looking to see if sky will cover every game with a pay per view option such a season ticket for each team if large gatherings are banned still
    But if you’ve subscribed already for a season ticket to the club you support, you’re surely not expected to pay Sky to watch your team on TV?

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    Quote Originally Posted by saintgeorge View Post
    But if you’ve subscribed already for a season ticket to the club you support, you’re surely not expected to pay Sky to watch your team on TV?
    Well that's the difficulty I guess..

    Maybe they could defer season tickets till next year.. a lot of discussion and decisions to be made

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    Quote Originally Posted by saintgeorge View Post
    But if you’ve subscribed already for a season ticket to the club you support, you’re surely not expected to pay Sky to watch your team on TV?
    Even more so if you have a season ticket and subscribe to Saints TV as well, if SKY cover every game you might as well wait 3 days for it to transfer on Saints TV especially if its played behind closed doors.

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    I don’t mind not accepting a refund for my season ticket in the long term interest of the club but I would have issues with paying extra for pay-per-view games involving Saints.

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    Ligue 1 and 2 in France have announced they will be not finishing the season after the French Government announced there will be no sport until September at the earliest.

    The RFL have povided a statement saying very little regarding Catalans/Toulouse but this will obviously have an effect on completing the Superleague/Championship seasons. I can't see this season being completed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by barry View Post
    Ligue 1 and 2 in France have announced they will be not finishing the season after the French Government announced there will be no sport until September at the earliest.

    The RFL have povided a statement saying very little regarding Catalans/Toulouse but this will obviously have an effect on completing the Superleague/Championship seasons. I can't see this season being completed.

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    https://amp.theguardian.com/sport/20...mpression=true

    Steve McNamara has commented to say Cats may have to move to the UK

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    In The West Stand saintgeorge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by barry View Post
    https://amp.theguardian.com/sport/20...mpression=true

    Steve McNamara has commented to say Cats may have to move to the UK

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    But won’t they need to adhere to the “new” quarantine rules for incomers - 2 weeks quarantine? There’s going to have to be some pretty radical thinking and planning to get any Super League this year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saintgeorge View Post
    But won’t they need to adhere to the “new” quarantine rules for incomers - 2 weeks quarantine? There’s going to have to be some pretty radical thinking and planning to get any Super League this year.
    I think it's going to be very difficult, you're right

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I think it's going to be very difficult, you're right
    You would think they'd be looking at making arrangements now. I think them being based in the Manchester area would be a good ideal and maybe they could use a amateur clubs facilities, how it works and how it's financed though is anyone's guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    I think it's going to be very difficult, you're right
    Rugby Union want to finish their season by having several days when all clubs play at the same venue like a series of Magic Weekends, obviously behind closed doors,but obviously every game covered by tv.. as we are following the French and Italy time line, I think that they will be lucky to get permission to do it, I know I am being pessimistic but I am beginning to think that even a Winter Season is the very best we can hope for as we have got so many games to fit in to make a realistic season, unless they throw the whole fixture list into the bin and immediately start a play off competition for the Grand Final and also continue with Wembley, at least there will be two competitions to play for, and if all games have to be played behind closed doors whats the use of hiring Wembley and Old Trafford, why not both finals played on a home and away basis

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    Quote Originally Posted by barry View Post
    Ligue 1 and 2 in France have announced they will be not finishing the season after the French Government announced there will be no sport until September at the earliest.

    The RFL have povided a statement saying very little regarding Catalans/Toulouse but this will obviously have an effect on completing the Superleague/Championship seasons. I can't see this season being completed.

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    W***ers put my inspection back a week too.

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