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Thread: Forward Pack Transition

  1. #26
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk The Wee Waa Womble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyprus View Post
    Part of the danger of an overseas coach is potential short term agenda thinking. If we have a great year with Wolfe he may then be gig back home mentality. I do feel Thompson going is pretty critical for us medium term. Ashworth isn't young by any means and I just think he lacks something a bit like Richards did. We needed a mongrel forward for years then Walmsley and Thompson jelled and bingo. Take those two out and we still lack aggression, size and youth in the pack.
    That’s where Mike Rush comes in. Planning for the future is part of his job.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

  2. #27
    In The South Stand Tez the Saint's Avatar
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    At some stage we’re going to have to expose Smith a bit more, the only way his defence is going to improve is by playing. Whoever replaces Roby IMO needs to be a proven, reliable SL player by that time comes. No-one expects another Roby but we need to know that we can rely on his replacement by then.

    I guess in terms of other positions, we’ll have to see how this season goes and what kind of form their in.
    Last edited by Tez the Saint; 6th February 2020 at 12:44.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    Most clubs are just happy to exist unfortunately. If it wasnt for Ken Davy, Huddersfield would have sunk long ago
    I'm not surprised; he was the idiot that staged a 'massive announcement' and then announced the club were selling their season tickets for near equivalent of a Co-op stamp.
    Great business, Ken. No wonder you advocated Rimmer.

  4. #29
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    My old man thinks the answer to Roby is moving Fages to 9 and signing a top class SH to bridge to Dodd coming through.

    I’m inclined to agree.


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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    That’s where Mike Rush comes in. Planning for the future is part of his job.
    Mike was about with Perry, Flannery and Llfranchi.

  6. #31
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk Scouse Don's Avatar
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    Dodd might be ready sooner than you think.
    Learned comment from The Don

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    In The South Stand Sean Day's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouse Don View Post
    Dodd might be ready sooner than you think.
    Yeah, there’s no way in the world he won’t be given an extended chance so you then would think that Fages may well end up at hooker, which is fine by me as I’m not convinced by Smith as a starter and even less so by Bentley.

    I’m also still unconvinced about Lees as a starting prop just yet, hopefully 12 months down the line he will be. I’ve just got awful memories of small Saints packs in the 2000s going nowhere. Bentley is definitely worth a go at second row and Batchelor off the bench.

    I like Ashworth but I’ve said many a time he is a second rower and he seems to have bulked up too much now to the point where he isn’t mobile enough any more. Very frustrating player - I just remember him coming off the bench at Wire a year or two ago and ripping them to shreds

  8. #33
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk Blobbynator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    i like Ashworth but I’ve said many a time he is a second rower and he seems to have bulked up too much now to the point where he isn’t mobile enough any more. Very frustrating player - I just remember him coming off the bench at Wire a year or two ago and ripping them to shreds
    He strikes me as a bit of a flat track bully Ashworth. Does well in the smaller games against weaker opposition but seems to hide behind better forwards. When we're on the front foot he seems to do well but he doesn't stand up when the chips are down. At least Lees has a go back even when we're beaten and Thompson is superb, but Ashworth is nowhere to be seen sometimes.
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  9. #34
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk Belgian Saint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    Yeah, there’s no way in the world he won’t be given an extended chance so you then would think that Fages may well end up at hooker, which is fine by me as I’m not convinced by Smith as a starter and even less so by Bentley.

    I’m also still unconvinced about Lees as a starting prop just yet, hopefully 12 months down the line he will be. I’ve just got awful memories of small Saints packs in the 2000s going nowhere. Bentley is definitely worth a go at second row and Batchelor off the bench.

    I like Ashworth but I’ve said many a time he is a second rower and he seems to have bulked up too much now to the point where he isn’t mobile enough any more. Very frustrating player - I just remember him coming off the bench at Wire a year or two ago and ripping them to shreds
    Like you I don't want a small pack, but you have just mentioned our smallest SR as a starter and second smallest off the bench.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    Yeah, there’s no way in the world he won’t be given an extended chance so you then would think that Fages may well end up at hooker, which is fine by me as I’m not convinced by Smith as a starter and even less so by Bentley.

    I’m also still unconvinced about Lees as a starting prop just yet, hopefully 12 months down the line he will be. I’ve just got awful memories of small Saints packs in the 2000s going nowhere. Bentley is definitely worth a go at second row and Batchelor off the bench.

    I like Ashworth but I’ve said many a time he is a second rower and he seems to have bulked up too much now to the point where he isn’t mobile enough any more. Very frustrating player - I just remember him coming off the bench at Wire a year or two ago and ripping them to shreds
    Like I said, we may have to suck it up for a few weeks but generally Lees doesn't start and is better for it. Bentley, I agree, it's not working but it's not his position either, seems a strong character though and I think he'll be better for it. Batchelor, I've no idea, he looked out of his depth on Thursday. 100% agree regarding Ashworth, again though, we may have to suck it for a while.

    I hope we see Dodd sooner rather than later but I'm not sure, Woolf seems quite defense orientated and I'm worried if we lose a few he's going to shut up shop a la KC. I just hope he realises we can afford to lose a few.

  11. #36
    Learning All The Songs barry's Avatar
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    Batchelor is 25 and has made no impact at all since he signed. I'd assume his days are numbered.

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    To be fair to Bathelor like Alex he came from a part time environment and it takes time. Jack is also 25 from a pathway development programme and can't be in the defensive line on your own line, that was basics and Clarke gobbled it up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    Like you I don't want a small pack, but you have just mentioned our smallest SR as a starter and second smallest off the bench.
    I think Bentley punches above his weight but you may be right in that he won’t carry us forward too well like Taia naturally does just through his size. Batchelor is a big enough lad I think, he could just do with a run of games to judge him off

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    In The West Stand Ralph Fridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I'm not surprised; he was the idiot that staged a 'massive announcement' and then announced the club were selling their season tickets for near equivalent of a Co-op stamp.
    Great business, Ken. No wonder you advocated Rimmer.
    You've got me there pal

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    I think Bentley punches above his weight but you may be right in that he won’t carry us forward too well like Taia naturally does just through his size. Batchelor is a big enough lad I think, he could just do with a run of games to judge him off
    We might have to give him a game soon enough

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    Quote Originally Posted by barry View Post
    Batchelor is 25 and has made no impact at all since he signed. I'd assume his days are numbered.

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    I bet Batchelor didn’t even know he was playing until ko time do I don’t think it’s fair to judge him on that game.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by saintgeorge View Post
    I bet Batchelor didn’t even know he was playing until ko time do I don’t think it’s fair to judge him on that game.
    I didn't mention the game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FearTheVee View Post
    My old man thinks the answer to Roby is moving Fages to 9 and signing a top class SH to bridge to Dodd coming through.

    I’m inclined to agree.


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    I am inclined to agree with your dad as well , Fages
    will definitely be better than Bentley & Smith , Hopefully
    Dodd gets some game time this season .

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    I'm still to be convinced regarding Bentley. Yes, he'll tackle all day - but I can't recall him busting tackles, or even getting his hands through (like Taia does). If we play him in Taia's channel, then we will have to significantly restructure our attack down that side. I know it's bad of me, but I can't help viewing Bentley as a 'poor man's Bateman'.

    WRT to Fages at hooker, have people thought he might really not want to play hooker? We seemed to be going down this route a couple of years ago; his form dropped and rumours of unrest and not signing a new contract began to creep in. We've just had in succession two world-class hookers, probably the best two to have played SL. Unless we go out and splurge mega-money on the best in the NRL, we're going to notice a drop-off. I personally think Smith has good distribution & a decent rugby brain. His defence, at the moment, has some room for improvement, but he's not exactly a Benny Barba.

    With Thompson going, we need a prop with that sort of muscle, to bend back the defensive line and be an enforcer. There's none on SL offering anything like his qualities, so we've got to look to the NRL and Woolf's contacts. And I don't think they'll come cheap.

    Just as vital IMO is a replacement for Taia. I've been told this is the last season for him and so, whilst he might look to be offering enough now, persuading him to go round another year (he'll be 37 during next season) risks us retaining a player in sharp decline who didn't want to be on the pitch anymore anyway. But again, there are no obvious replacements in SL who offer the rangey running and ball-handling ablity that Zeb brings.

  20. #45
    In The West Stand Dux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Webbo Again View Post
    I'm still to be convinced regarding Bentley. Yes, he'll tackle all day - but I can't recall him busting tackles, or even getting his hands through (like Taia does). If we play him in Taia's channel, then we will have to significantly restructure our attack down that side. I know it's bad of me, but I can't help viewing Bentley as a 'poor man's Bateman'.

    WRT to Fages at hooker, have people thought he might really not want to play hooker? We seemed to be going down this route a couple of years ago; his form dropped and rumours of unrest and not signing a new contract began to creep in. We've just had in succession two world-class hookers, probably the best two to have played SL. Unless we go out and splurge mega-money on the best in the NRL, we're going to notice a drop-off. I personally think Smith has good distribution & a decent rugby brain. His defence, at the moment, has some room for improvement, but he's not exactly a Benny Barba.

    With Thompson going, we need a prop with that sort of muscle, to bend back the defensive line and be an enforcer. There's none on SL offering anything like his qualities, so we've got to look to the NRL and Woolf's contacts. And I don't think they'll come cheap.

    Just as vital IMO is a replacement for Taia. I've been told this is the last season for him and so, whilst he might look to be offering enough now, persuading him to go round another year (he'll be 37 during next season) risks us retaining a player in sharp decline who didn't want to be on the pitch anymore anyway. But again, there are no obvious replacements in SL who offer the rangey running and ball-handling ablity that Zeb brings.
    The other thing about Fages at hooker is that whenever I've seen him play there he's been pretty poor. I can see why people suggest it because he's nippy, has decent hands and is also tough, but based on what I've seen there are no indications that his distribution and decision making from dummy half are at the required standard.

    I don't think there are any obvious solutions presenting themselves at the moment. Bentley just isn't a hooker and while Smith is more naturally suited to the role in possession his defence is a real concern and we always concede quick play the balls when he's on the field. I think that's something you can put up with if the player is something special in other areas, but I'm not sure that's the case with Smith. I was looking forward to seeing more of Eaves, but it sounds like that's going to have to wait now, too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Day View Post
    I think Bentley punches above his weight but you may be right in that he won’t carry us forward too well like Taia naturally does just through his size. Batchelor is a big enough lad I think, he could just do with a run of games to judge him off
    Neither Bentley or Batchelor have anywhere near the ability to play for us beyond their current deals.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    The other thing about Fages at hooker is that whenever I've seen him play there he's been pretty poor. I can see why people suggest it because he's nippy, has decent hands and is also tough, but based on what I've seen there are no indications that his distribution and decision making from dummy half are at the required standard..
    What is the deal with Eaves? We saw him at Leeds and he looked good, but he's nowhere to be seen again? Smith can't defend, Bentley isn't a hooker.

    I like the idea of Dodd or Welsby playing in the halves to push Fages to 9 personally. He has great hands and can pick a pass from 7, so I can't see why 9 would trouble him. He's older and wiser now, I think we should give that a go whilst Roby is out personally.

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    I think Bentley has a lot of good in his game although not at hooker. My fear is he and Morgan are similar in build and a bit on the small and light side to bein the same back row. We need some size bringing in and in my opinion ASAP. Alex is our only real big ruffian.

  24. #49
    In The West Stand Ralph Fridge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fonsboy View Post
    I am inclined to agree with your dad as well , Fages
    will definitely be better than Bentley & Smith , Hopefully
    Dodd gets some game time this season .
    Fully agree as well. Fages can play 9. Get a good 7 in to play alongside Lomax

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saddened! View Post
    What is the deal with Eaves? We saw him at Leeds and he looked good, but he's nowhere to be seen again? Smith can't defend, Bentley isn't a hooker.

    I like the idea of Dodd or Welsby playing in the halves to push Fages to 9 personally. He has great hands and can pick a pass from 7, so I can't see why 9 would trouble him. He's older and wiser now, I think we should give that a go whilst Roby is out personally.
    Re: Eaves, someone posted the other day that he's broken his leg in training, so he's not going to have a chance to work his way up the pecking order anytime soon.

    Happy to be proved wrong about Fages at 9, but I do remember his passing off the floor being all over the place. Mind you, he's come on a bundle as a half back, so I suppose it's perfectly possible that he could do the same as a hooker.

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