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Thread: Every game matters...?

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post
    It may be nostalgia, it may be a rose-tinted view of my youth, but the system we had when I was growing up has IMO never been beaten in the 20-odd years since Super League came about.

    14 team league, 26 game league season, team at top is Champions.
    Top 8 Premiership comp at the end of the season, final at Old Trafford.

    I accept that the JPS/Regal Trophy and the County Cups fell by the wayside for a decent reason, but the rest of it was great in my opinion. League games were important, the Cup was massive because it gave teams out of the title race another goal to go for half way through the season, and the Premiership was a decent little comp at the end of the season which clubs took pretty seriously. It gave the reward of a home QF for finishing Top 4 and gave the reward of a chance of a trophy for those who finished Top 8.

    In many seasons Saints priorities as the season went on were as follows...
    Try and win the league
    League is not do-able, prioritise the Cup
    We've been knocked out of the Cup, get a Top 4 spot for a Premiership Home QF

    It all tied in for me, and the current format just doesn't match up. League games are diluted, the Cup has been talked down over many years by the broadcasters of the league, and the season drifts for long periods because games just aren't as important IMO.

    I don't think I feel any differently about Saints now than I did in the mid 80s when I started following them. They're my hometown club, I love them, and they are a part of my life that I will never let go. But back in the day I'd look forward to games all week. I'd be gutted when we lost a league game, I'd be delighted when we won one. The league table and upcoming fixtures were obsessed over, and Cup games were big things. Now, I'm annoyed a bit when we lose a league game, and I don't go overboard when we win games because I know they don't actually help us win anything unless we get it done in Sept/Oct.

    My feelings towards Saints haven't changed, but my feelings towards the game have.

    But people didn't want dead rubbers, straight league creates that particularly this year

    The premiership wasn't taken seriously, it was the festival game at the end of the year, the least desired comp and a bit of a joke

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    And the same corporation is playing a massive part in making the sport look daft. Needs a complete fresh look this sport & it's structure.

    Next season I'm really tempted just to rock up in September. Then the Aussie team tour. Rest of it is becoming a training run
    I've never seen s player take a field and onside it a training run, of your not tuned in you get hurt

    To the players every game means a lot

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    And a major reason the same corporation fronted up big money in the UK in the first place was because they wanted to win the war against the old ARL in Australia and isolate them as much as possible. It always makes me laugh when people present SKY as some kind of Samaritan group. They never have been and never will be. They've taken advantage as weak leadership at the RFL down the years and the sport has been made ot look successively daft. Its almost as if we're the 'soft lad' for any SKY gimmick they want to trial.
    But the rfl don't have lots of people with money knocking on the door, if there sre no alternatives then you have no bargaining power

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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    But people didn't want dead rubbers, straight league creates that particularly this year

    The premiership wasn't taken seriously, it was the festival game at the end of the year, the least desired comp and a bit of a joke
    I agree with everyone 're the league being devalued, but take Saints out of the equation and actually the battle for 2nd place must be quite exciting for the fans of the club's involved, I honestly cannot see either us or anyone else running away with it by such a large margin next year, so I hope they don't tinker with it again, actually I rather liked beating Wigan and Warrington three times in a season. It will be a lot harder for us next year with no new recruits, an untested coach, and a few players like Tai and even Roby who are getting into the veteran stage when the injuries start creeping up on you like happened to Sculthorpe and co.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    I've never seen s player take a field and onside it a training run, of your not tuned in you get hurt

    To the players every game means a lot
    That's funny because Leeds kept winning the comp from 5th
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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    But people didn't want dead rubbers, straight league creates that particularly this year

    The premiership wasn't taken seriously, it was the festival game at the end of the year, the least desired comp and a bit of a joke
    Who didn’t?
    There will always be dead rubbers in whatever format. Its a disrespectful term to professional athletes which suggest they don’t or won’t care for these games. A smokescreen for broadcasters who want artificial sensationalism at any opportunity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    Who didn’t?
    There will always be dead rubbers in whatever format. Its a disrespectful term to professional athletes which suggest they don’t or won’t care for these games. A smokescreen for broadcasters who want artificial sensationalism at any opportunity.

    I agree, but you cannot claim you have never heard the argument. It is a persistent argument that there are to many meaningless games with a straight league format and play offs keeps the league interesting and most teams have things to play for

    That's one argument given for a play off system, same argument for the middle eights system etc.

    theres also the grand final, the showpiece for Sky who give us our money
    Last edited by Upside; 3rd September 2019 at 12:35.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    That's funny because Leeds kept winning the comp from 5th

    Not sure Leeds winning from fifth proves players take the field not caring if they win or not?

    Players taking the field always want to win, fans may care less if there's nothing on it but players do

    The play off system benefits the team finishing first so still an advantage

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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    Not sure Leeds winning from fifth proves players take the field not caring if they win or not?

    Players taking the field always want to win, fans may care less if there's nothing on it but players do

    The play off system benefits the team finishing first so still an advantage
    True
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    That's funny because Leeds kept winning the comp from 5th
    Not the inorgural (sp) top 5 system? I've not researched but I'm fairly sure only top 2 teams have won it.

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    There is no way all teams put in 100% effort for every league game. You only have to look at Hull who conceded 55 points to Huddersfield at home and five days later stuck 50 on Catalans in the cup. You can afford to blow off multiple games in the league and still win the big prize. Not sure of the best solution but to me if you win the league the reward should take you straight to the grand final and 2-5 can play off for the remaining spot. This would make the league more valued.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ffs View Post
    There is no way all teams put in 100% effort for every league game. You only have to look at Hull who conceded 55 points to Huddersfield at home and five days later stuck 50 on Catalans in the cup. You can afford to blow off multiple games in the league and still win the big prize. Not sure of the best solution but to me if you win the league the reward should take you straight to the grand final and 2-5 can play off for the remaining spot. This would make the league more valued.

    If you rest players, maybe have a short turnaround, play unfit players, bad refereeing (I know, I know.....) or have difficult conditions (wet pitch for example, or 30 degree heat......(!!!)) it’s possible to get an absolute spanking whilst trying your very very best.

    Did Wigan give 100% on Good Friday when we pasted them? I’m absolutely certain they did. Wire tried their hardest against Salford the other day with a tired squad missing some players......
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    Was chatting to a few saints fans on facebook before and I'd say 50% of them thought we might struggle to make old Trafford,, i wonder what people's thoughts are on this forum?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    Was chatting to a few saints fans on facebook before and I'd say 50% of them thought we might struggle to make old Trafford,, i wonder what people's thoughts are on this forum?
    I think the CC cup shook a few people. Personally, I think it will be a struggle to win the first game though I'd be surprised if we blew 2 opportunities to get there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    I think the CC cup shook a few people. Personally, I think it will be a struggle to win the first game though I'd be surprised if we blew 2 opportunities to get there.
    I fear playing Salford more than Wigan in the play offs

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Fridge View Post
    Honest mate I've had enough although as Grey has pointed out, the GB Lions might just keep me interested. A full Aussie tour would be amazing.

    There was one planned for 2001 but they only did the 3 tests in the end as it was after 9/11.

    The RFL will still find a way to cock it up I'm sure
    You can't pack it in, you would be bored to tears without the ingenious promotional strategies from the RL, the consistency of Referees, and the love shown for Saints fans by Wigan and Wire.
    I am in a different situation to you I can only get to about 6 games per year and therefore wouldn't dream of missing any of those. I have just arrived in St Helens today and can't wait for Fri.

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    An interesting point that was raised was the rfl could boost next years cc final attendance by offering anyone attending this years grand final a discount on their Wembley tickets?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    You can't pack it in, you would be bored to tears without the ingenious promotional strategies from the RL, the consistency of Referees, and the love shown for Saints fans by Wigan and Wire.
    I am in a different situation to you I can only get to about 6 games per year and therefore wouldn't dream of missing any of those. I have just arrived in St Helens today and can't wait for Fri.
    Glad to hear you're home sir.

    Good to see it still means a lot to people. I do feel a bit like a spoiled kid saying what I said but I do think the sport is in a right mess
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    An interesting point that was raised was the rfl could boost next years cc final attendance by offering anyone attending this years grand final a discount on their Wembley tickets?
    Don't see how that's not a good idea to be honest. I'm all for it
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    I fear playing Salford more than Wigan in the play offs
    I can cope with losing to Salford
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    I fear playing Salford more than Wigan in the play offs
    Good call

    Salford have moral and justifiable good reason to have it in for you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    An interesting point that was raised was the rfl could boost next years cc final attendance by offering anyone attending this years grand final a discount on their Wembley tickets?

    Good idea but not without risk. If you have 20k people wanting to return regardless of team that's a good start. If we give those 20k 50% reduction we need to seek 40k at that price

    The casual viewer who is undecided learns they need to pay double that of reurners they may feel tricked

    Simply reducing ticket fee isn't always a good business plan

    Some businesses have gone bust lowering prices, you devalue your products the new low fee is seen as the market value

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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    Good idea but not without risk. If you have 20k people wanting to return regardless of team that's a good start. If we give those 20k 50% reduction we need to seek 40k at that price

    The casual viewer who is undecided learns they need to pay double that of reurners they may feel tricked

    Simply reducing ticket fee isn't always a good business plan

    Some businesses have gone bust lowering prices, you devalue your products the new low fee is seen as the market value
    Personally, i think ticket prices for the grand final are quite reasonable,, i mean anyone could watch the biggest game in the rugby league calendar for as little as 20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mancunian Saint View Post
    Personally, i think ticket prices for the grand final are quite reasonable,, i mean anyone could watch the biggest game in the rugby league calendar for as little as 20

    I don't believe ticket prices are the issue, if we lower them more we make our product look worthless

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    Quote Originally Posted by Upside View Post
    I don't believe ticket prices are the issue, if we lower them more we make our product look worthless
    I agree, but as a one off gesture, it might attract new fans. And a few fans of other clubs have suggested maybe changing the gf kick off time as the see 6pm on a Saturday as being too late,, personally i dont have an issue with it

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