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Thread: No Coote For Semi

  1. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaintH517 View Post
    You’ve just used incorrect stats to suggest that Richardson didn’t run it a lot, so I don’t think you have a clue how many times he did. I’m struggling to recall us once utilising a set play with Coote out the back on the last tackle and the idea that Barba was invisible the last couple of months of the season is nonsense. Yes he dropped off but he was never realistically going to be able to maintain the level of form he produced, when at his best, for a full season. The criticism he got when he was the main reason for us being top was absolutely ridiculous, especially when players whose performances were actually detrimental to the team, like Richardson, got a free pass.

    How can you possibly put the right edge being more threatening down to Richardson when he played there for the whole of last season and it was largely ineffective? As for the part in bold you must be taking the p*ss. If anything Holbrook agrees with me. I’ve said Richardson isn’t good enough for ages and Holbrook has literally dropped him despite him getting in the dream team and the majority of the fan base jumping on the bandwagon in singing his praises. I’m not sure how that is Holbrook playing him without hesitation or concern. It seems to me that Holbrook doesn’t think Richardson is very good which is why he doesn’t get into our best team.
    SaintH517 your summarising of Richardson and Barba for the second half of last season is pretty much spot on to me. Barba`s performance did inevitably tail off as his opening matches standard was so high and defenses copped on as we seemed to lack a plan B. His own defence was a criticised by most in the NRL and stopped his rep honours as many said he would only be useful as a runner in the last 20 when tiredness came into effect. Richardson has talent there is no doubt, but he does make the same mistakes repeatedly, will this stop, only time will tell. Is he a running Scrum Half or a controlling half, he is not lighting but he is explosive, Gregory and Goulding were not quick but they were deceptive and could put their noses through on a half break (Gregory in paticular his nose went through a few seconds before his body) or is he a Deacon type kicking controlling half, again time will tell. He has the ability to be any of these type. he may have plateaued again we will not know until he cements a spot either with us or elsewhere.

  2. #127
    Learning All The Songs bewareshadows's Avatar
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    You don't fix up everything in your game over a season. Gaskell is a perfect example of this, he had a couple of seasons with us and expectations were way in excess of what they should have been.

    Sure a limited number of halfbacks are amazing from 18 onwards, but others are just talented and need to build up the rest of their game over 3-4 years.

    Personally if I was a young halfback I would not want to play for saints. The fans show little patience with our own.

    If you are a second rower, winger (not so much centre) then mistakes get forgiven. But creative attacking positions seem to have less time before it is expected that they be a top flight player.

    Much better to play for a Salford, Wigan, cas who give these types of players time and space to develop.

    Saints demand top performers in these positions and I can't actually recall a time when we allowed a player to develop (and before anyone shouts Lomax). Lomax was not always the fan or club favourite.

    I recall many conversations on here saying he would never come good. If there was one long lasting positive of having Barba in the team it was that it pushed Lomax back into the halves and took the focus off Lomax in the halves and allowed him that time to settle into the role and also gave him a more experienced head to work with.

  3. #128
    In The West Stand Ralph Fridge's Avatar
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    Richardson played his junior rugby at 6 and in the academy he was at 6. He is now playing at 7. People will say it doesn't matter but I'm not having it. Stand off & scrum half are different positions. Richardson is having to adapt his game & learn.

    He had a poor game in the semi final against Warrington. His decision making was terrible. When he's played this season, I think he's been alright bar the game at London in June & that ridiculous up & under at the DW. That was one of the most stupid things I've ever seen on a rugby pitch.

    Is he worth persevering with? Totally. He's a brilliant goalkicker & in a tight game, he'll kick you a drop goal. If it was up to me, Fages & Lomax would start but I'd go with three forwards & Danny on the bench. No one is the complete player at 22. Particularly a scrum half, centres or Fullbacks. He's pretty quick, can put people in holes & he's a good support runner. Plays like more of a 6 than a 7 to be honest.

  4. #129
    In The North Stand With All The Old Folk STIDDY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaintH517 View Post
    You’ve just used incorrect stats to suggest that Richardson didn’t run it a lot, so I don’t think you have a clue how many times he did. I’m struggling to recall us once utilising a set play with Coote out the back on the last tackle and the idea that Barba was invisible the last couple of months of the season is nonsense. Yes he dropped off but he was never realistically going to be able to maintain the level of form he produced, when at his best, for a full season. The criticism he got when he was the main reason for us being top was absolutely ridiculous, especially when players whose performances were actually detrimental to the team, like Richardson, got a free pass.

    How can you possibly put the right edge being more threatening down to Richardson when he played there for the whole of last season and it was largely ineffective? As for the part in bold you must be taking the p*ss. If anything Holbrook agrees with me. I’ve said Richardson isn’t good enough for ages and Holbrook has literally dropped him despite him getting in the dream team and the majority of the fan base jumping on the bandwagon in singing his praises. I’m not sure how that is Holbrook playing him without hesitation or concern. It seems to me that Holbrook doesn’t think Richardson is very good which is why he doesn’t get into our best team.
    I've used the match stats from last year to see who was involved in the game if you think they are incorrect because it doesn't suit your perspective then tell Superleague.com for amendment. Your comment on Coote on Barba tells me you just watch the game and can't see the game thats why you seem to have an assassination agenda on certain players.

    For the Richardson and the right hand edge that confirms you have that assassination agenda in your head, you are suggesting Richardson was not the reason our right edge got working on the basis that he couldn't do it last season so he couldn't do it for this season either.

    Lastly, I can only assume you cannot accept that Richardson had hip and groin injuries at the back end of the season, his surgery in the off season put him 4 weeks behind everyone else in terms of conditioning. In the meantime Fages was training the house down and was at a pivotal point in his career with a new contract within and outside of the club. As for Holbrook it was a no brainer for Fages/Lomax to start and as a result it was a test of character for Richardson to be waiting in the wings and personally I thought he handled it quite well, no doubt you will see otherwise but don't start writing garbage and not expect to be challenged over it.

  5. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaintH517 View Post
    There isn’t much disklike for Richardson on here, it wasn’t that long ago that people were comparing him to Sean Long. I think people over time saw he wasn’t that good. I don’t think you can put his poor choice of last tackle plays down to age or experience. He’s played 50 super league games and is 22. He’s young but not the kid he’s made out to be and he’s shown no signs of improvement in any area apart from in defence but he’s still questionable there. A few last minute conversions and drop goals masked over what were poor 80 minute performances from him regularly last season and thankfully Holbrook saw it in a similar way because he cost us in the play off semi final with one of the worst performances I’ve seen from a scrum half.
    Fully agree with this.

  6. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    Richardson didn't run the ball so much according to the stats he only made 4 carries. Barba had been AWOL long before the last play off game, first half of the season he came into the second phase and the run on the last play from Richardson + Lomax but that disappeared once he was NRL bound. If Barba had performed like he performed in his first 10 games we would have won the Warrington game......FACT!!!
    But you don't believe the stats are correct do you, or is it selective as usual?
    The fact that they are provided by an independent organisation should give you a clue?

    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    Just watched your game on YouTube, don't know where the stats man got 160 metres from he only made 3 hard runs of 10-15 metres and his 20 metre run for his last try. Also most of his tackles were 2nd or 3rd man in. Willie Isa was the best forward for you lot.

  7. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogues Gallery View Post
    But you don't believe the stats are correct do you, or is it selective as usual?
    The fact that they are provided by an independent organisation should give you a clue?
    Well the stat facts that Barba only made 2 try assists in our last 7 super 8 play off games backs up my observation that he wasn't all that good for us at the back end of the season. Some stats are more solid and less flexible than others.

    At the beginning of that season he would average almost 2 try assists a game that attribute completely dried up during the super 8 and the final play off game.
    Last edited by STIDDY; 27th July 2019 at 09:49.

  8. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    Well the stat facts that Barba only made 2 try assists in our last 7 super 8 play off games backs up my observation that he wasn't all that good for us at the back end of the season. Some stats are more solid and less flexible than others.

    At the beginning of that season he would average almost 2 try assists a game that attribute completely dried up during the super 8 and the final play off game.
    I must say I’ve always thought counting ‘assists’ in RL was completely meaningless. All it tells you is who gave the last pass.

  9. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaintH517 View Post
    As that’s coming from you and given some of your views, I’ll take that as a compliment.
    Some of my views? Care to elaborate on that? It's not me who dedicates his life to slagging off a 22 year old lad who's currently playing for by far and away the best team in SL. So I stand by my original comment, you're a helmet and if you want to discuss it further PM me xxxx

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogues Gallery View Post
    But you don't believe the stats are correct do you, or is it selective as usual?
    The fact that they are provided by an independent organisation should give you a clue?
    It must really annoy you when we have players that would walk in to your team that barely get a game for us.

  11. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angry Dave View Post
    It must really annoy you when we have players that would walk in to your team that barely get a game for us.
    Is there a single Wigan player you would swap for his opposite number at Saints?

  12. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angry Dave View Post
    It must really annoy you when we have players that would walk in to your team that barely get a game for us.
    Spot on mate!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    Is there a single Wigan player you would swap for his opposite number at Saints?
    Possibly Gildart for Naiqama, other than that no.

  14. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angry Dave View Post
    Possibly Gildart for Naiqama, other than that no.
    And even that one is only possibly. Just shows how bad they are this year. You can bet that when they have something to gloat about, three will be more than Rogues on here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    And even that one is only possibly. Just shows how bad they are this year. You can bet that when they have something to gloat about, three will be more than Rogues on here.
    To be fair I don't think anyone takes him seriously, the bloke is a clown but at the same time, it's good for the board and some of the garbage he comes out with is quite amusing.

  16. #141
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    Knowles is a huge miss. Paulo needs to straighten up when he’s passing it out the back like knowles does. He’s crabbing across taking away all the space instead of creating it.

  17. #142
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    Wow. Just wow.

  18. #143
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    like the saints of old

  19. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimmy h View Post
    like the saints of old
    From 2015-mid2017
    Can't stop the spirits when they need you.

    This life is more than just a read through.

  20. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimmy h View Post
    like the saints of old
    Missing Cootes patience. Remember our right half is playing left half and our left half is out the back. Along with that most have had two weeks.

    Regain some composure and we will be ok. If we dont we will cause yourself some real stress

  21. #146
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    Give it to Grace, be fine. I’m all the way over on the right? Be fine we will catch em out. Oh, ok no worries.

  22. #147
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    Depending how long Coote is out will JH give Danny more game time hoping he will improve or will he experiment with different full backs? I don't think Danny did himself any favours today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notawiginfan View Post
    Depending how long Coote is out will JH give Danny more game time hoping he will improve or will he experiment with different full backs? I don't think Danny did himself any favours today.
    No, me either, he was pretty awful for most of the game although made a couple of decent breaks and generally kicked ok. That said Lomax wasn't too great either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notawiginfan View Post
    Depending how long Coote is out will JH give Danny more game time hoping he will improve or will he experiment with different full backs? I don't think Danny did himself any favours today.

    I don't like calling our own but sadly I don't think he was good today, it's a shame but I don't think SL is his level currently, maybe in a few years

  25. #150
    Learning All The Songs Blue Harvest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notawiginfan View Post
    Depending how long Coote is out will JH give Danny more game time hoping he will improve or will he experiment with different full backs? I don't think Danny did himself any favours today.
    I don't quite agree there. What perhaps is worth trying is leaving Fages on the right, but putting Richardson on the left. Fages appears to have found himself comfortable operating there this season, maybe allowing him to continue this will cause less disruption to the team.

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