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    Default Oops

    Oh dear that came as a surprise. 12 nil up and losing to a championship team elect, surely there will be more spring in the steps of the Halifax players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notawiginfan View Post
    Oh dear that came as a surprise. 12 nil up and losing to a championship team elect, surely there will be more spring in the steps of the Halifax players.
    Sheer arrogance to leave out so many key players and got what they deserved. Well done London
    . Says a lot about the squad depth outside the 19 or so, not as good as people think.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stokesaint1 View Post
    Sheer arrogance to leave out so many key players and got what they deserved. Well done London
    . Says a lot about the squad depth outside the 19 or so, not as good as people think.

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    To some extent I understand the argument for resting players to give us a better chance of having a full and fit squad later on in more important games. However, resting so many at the same time doesn't sit comfortably with me and today was a couple too many. It must disrupt previous momentum, preparation, structure and systems. Having said all that, looking at the team sheets the players we put out should have been more than capable of blowing London away. So why didn't we? Was it arrogance, complacency or a lazy attitude? Runaway leaders beaten by a poor bottom club makes us look silly. I bet Ryan Morgan, especially, will have a huge smile on his face for days. I hope this result doesn't affect us mentally for the Huddersfield match. We'll see. Not happy but rant over.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stokesaint1 View Post
    Sheer arrogance to leave out so many key players and got what they deserved. Well done London
    . Says a lot about the squad depth outside the 19 or so, not as good as people think.
    I don't think its arrogance at all, the 17 players we put out was good enough to win this game, it was individual errors that cost us the game and Broncos took full advantage of it. Still 10 points clear of 3rd place beat Warrington in the coming weeks and we are back to a 6pt gap for the LLS.

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    Thompson, LMS and Percival will not yet be back up to speed and add in Amor who has missed a few and it was not the time to rest so many.

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    Think the turning point was at 12-0 when we had another set of 6 with chance to go 18-0 up.
    We made mistake and then they got a try to make it 12-6 and they got belief.
    Some poor last tackle options from Richardson, although Richardson did well to get kick from touchline to level it up at the end.
    Broncos defended very well tho.
    Few iffy decisions by ref. Especially when Percy looked like he caught it behind try line but ref gave a drop out.
    And from where I was sat it look like London’s drop goal attempt to win the game missed the posts to the left.
    We also badly missed Coote today for his kicking at end of the set.
    Still top of the league tho. COYS

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    London have lost some games this season they deserved to win! and they have had some surprise wins! I do think there may have been a little its only London lets rest some players! all sides not on TV have iffy decisions, you take that! missing the posts to the left?? not convinced with that! lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    I don't think its arrogance at all, the 17 players we put out was good enough to win this game, it was individual errors that cost us the game and Broncos took full advantage of it. Still 10 points clear of 3rd place beat Warrington in the coming weeks and we are back to a 6pt gap for the LLS.
    Exactly. That team should have been good enough. We are still well placed and a few players have had a rest. Also, for London playing against us is like their cup final and they would have really been up for it. They have lost a couple of games that could have gone either way, so not too sorry to see there enthusiasm pay off for once.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    Also, for London playing against us is like their cup final and they would have really been up for it.
    No it wasn't, it was just another game we needed to win.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FormerSaint View Post
    No it wasn't, it was just another game we needed to win.
    Maybe not just another game for them.

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    No they wasn't good enough or they'd have won it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stokesaint1 View Post
    Sheer arrogance to leave out so many key players and got what they deserved. Well done London
    . Says a lot about the squad depth outside the 19 or so, not as good as people think.
    It's a squad game so I don't consider it resting as such but more rotating

    And there was well enough quality to win that game, hats of to London who are better than people think, particularly at their home ground

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    Making so many changes can disrupt things. And it appears that’s what happened today.

    Another gentle reminder that no matter how good you think you are, if you’re not quite at it, you’ll get turned over


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    I said it after the Catalans game that a defeat every now and again does you no harm. Helps to refocus the mind!

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    Also, Broncos were definitely helped by Mo Salah turning out for them, with number 2 on his back, though why he preferred that to a nice long holiday after June 1st is beyond me. And why disguise himself as Rhys Williams?

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    #wtf

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canterbredve View Post
    Also, Broncos were definitely helped by Mo Salah turning out for them, with number 2 on his back, though why he preferred that to a nice long holiday after June 1st is beyond me. And why disguise himself as Rhys Williams?
    Ha Ha - I have noticed him too

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    Some of the reaction on here and social media makes me despair.

    Last year everyone said we burnt out and were tired for the big games because we didn’t rotate the squad and flogged everyone all season. Holbrook has clearly changed his approach this year so he obviously thinks the same.

    The way the league works with the play off system means finishing first doesn’t actually really matter, yes you get 100K and the league leaders shield but the majority of people (our club included based on the way we “celebrated” it last year) don’t really care about those things. The goal of the season is to win the challenge cup and finish in the Top 5, get to Old Trafford and win the Grand Final.

    We were 6 points clear, playing a side at the bottom of the table and had played a quarter final the week before which we won which means we now don’t have a free week until August at the earliest. There is no way players are going to be able to play from now until the end of the season without having a rest, especially as they are all now playing longer minutes due to the decreased interchanges.

    I think most people accept we need to rotate and realistically the games we are going to do this are the likes of London, HKR, Salford etc. Fans are going to have to accept this increases the risk of potentially losing these games in order to give our players a rest, we will continue to do this whilst we have a commanding position at the top of the table. That’s the benefit of being clear at the top.

    That team yesterday was good enough to win, the only players you would class as not established first team players were Costello (who didn’t play that many minutes) and Welsby. The rest are all first team regulars and would get a starting place in many super league sides. The problem was poor basics and execution of plays, the amount of errors we made was ridiculous. Simple dropped balls, poor passing execution, missed tackles and letting the ball bounce from kicks etc. I don’t know if it was down to poor preparation (I know a few of the players were away for a couple of days at the beginning of the week) or lack of respect for opposition, players can just have an off day just like we all have bad days at work. The fact we have a few players returning from injury and getting up to match speed also had an effect probably.

    The only minor issue I have with the rotation is I think we need to be a bit more selective in who rotates. Personally I think we need to have 1 of Makinson/Coote in the back line, it makes us more solid defensively and they can organise us plus our kick returns would be better.

    Overall whilst it’s disappointing to lose it doesn’t change any of the season for ourselves, players have had a rest, others have got another game in their recovery from injury out the way and a kick up the arse will do some good. I think we will continue to rotate for the next few weeks and then a couple of weeks before the semi final go full tilt again. I’ve got no problem with that and that’s coming from someone who did travel down to London yesterday and despite the result had a really good day out.


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    Quote Originally Posted by macca24 View Post
    The way the league works with the play off system means finishing first doesn’t actually really matter, yes you get 100K and the league leaders shield but the majority of people (our club included based on the way we “celebrated” it last year) don’t really care about those things. The goal of the season is to win the challenge cup and finish in the Top 5, get to Old Trafford and win the Grand Final.
    No team outside the top 2 ever won under the current system. Finishing top gives you a significant advantage: win one home game and you're in the final. It's worth taking seriously for that reason, IMO. We've still got to go to Warrington twice and Hull twice, so I don't think we're in a position to be happy with throwing points away yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by macca24 View Post
    Some of the reaction on here and social media makes me despair.

    Last year everyone said we burnt out and were tired for the big games because we didn’t rotate the squad and flogged everyone all season. Holbrook has clearly changed his approach this year so he obviously thinks the same.

    The way the league works with the play off system means finishing first doesn’t actually really matter, yes you get 100K and the league leaders shield but the majority of people (our club included based on the way we “celebrated” it last year) don’t really care about those things. The goal of the season is to win the challenge cup and finish in the Top 5, get to Old Trafford and win the Grand Final.

    We were 6 points clear, playing a side at the bottom of the table and had played a quarter final the week before which we won which means we now don’t have a free week until August at the earliest. There is no way players are going to be able to play from now until the end of the season without having a rest, especially as they are all now playing longer minutes due to the decreased interchanges.

    I think most people accept we need to rotate and realistically the games we are going to do this are the likes of London, HKR, Salford etc. Fans are going to have to accept this increases the risk of potentially losing these games in order to give our players a rest, we will continue to do this whilst we have a commanding position at the top of the table. That’s the benefit of being clear at the top.

    That team yesterday was good enough to win, the only players you would class as not established first team players were Costello (who didn’t play that many minutes) and Welsby. The rest are all first team regulars and would get a starting place in many super league sides. The problem was poor basics and execution of plays, the amount of errors we made was ridiculous. Simple dropped balls, poor passing execution, missed tackles and letting the ball bounce from kicks etc. I don’t know if it was down to poor preparation (I know a few of the players were away for a couple of days at the beginning of the week) or lack of respect for opposition, players can just have an off day just like we all have bad days at work. The fact we have a few players returning from injury and getting up to match speed also had an effect probably.

    The only minor issue I have with the rotation is I think we need to be a bit more selective in who rotates. Personally I think we need to have 1 of Makinson/Coote in the back line, it makes us more solid defensively and they can organise us plus our kick returns would be better.

    Overall whilst it’s disappointing to lose it doesn’t change any of the season for ourselves, players have had a rest, others have got another game in their recovery from injury out the way and a kick up the arse will do some good. I think we will continue to rotate for the next few weeks and then a couple of weeks before the semi final go full tilt again. I’ve got no problem with that and that’s coming from someone who did travel down to London yesterday and despite the result had a really good day out.
    A good post, one I agree with. I was surprised and disappointed to hear dig out Holbrook for rotating the squad; the reality was that the players did not perform yesterday and the team fielded was more than good enough to have won the game comfortably.

    I'll stick my neck on the block; the level of indignation after the defeat shows how thick and stupid some Saints fans are. This is highly likely to be an inconsequential loss and it appears the same people who would have criticised if Coote or Lomax got injured, the forwards look jaded in big games etc want to use the benefit of hindsight to come out with pathetic diatribe. Quite frankly these supporters should watch drift away and watch chess.

    This loss is hardly the en of the world and I don't think JH will be frantic and panicking about it. Rather he will have learnt quite a lot form yesterdays match and it would appear quite a few supporters need to as well. Empty vessels and all that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eddiewaringsflatcap View Post
    A good post, one I agree with. I was surprised and disappointed to hear dig out Holbrook for rotating the squad; the reality was that the players did not perform yesterday and the team fielded was more than good enough to have won the game comfortably.

    I'll stick my neck on the block; the level of indignation after the defeat shows how thick and stupid some Saints fans are. This is highly likely to be an inconsequential loss and it appears the same people who would have criticised if Coote or Lomax got injured, the forwards look jaded in big games etc want to use the benefit of hindsight to come out with pathetic diatribe. Quite frankly these supporters should watch drift away and watch chess.

    This loss is hardly the en of the world and I don't think JH will be frantic and panicking about it. Rather he will have learnt quite a lot form yesterdays match and it would appear quite a few supporters need to as well. Empty vessels and all that.
    We stood with some of the London speccies yesterday. Some of them young lads and lasses who were probably pretty new to the sport.

    I was pretty impressed by what they were saying. They are trying to learn about the game, they were surprised at how disjointed our attack was & were asking if we were surprised by how much Lomax & Coote not playing affected our play.

    Then in the other stand, some of our lot singing about Wigan & Warrington. I don't know who this lot are but our vocal support is cringeworthy at times. I wish they'd get lost as they're making us look daft

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    Rotation will come again the Sunday before ghe semi when we play - London away!

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    There are different views about Sunday’s game and apart from the most extreme they all have some validity. Did we lose because of the changes? In part yes. Did we lose because on the day we were out played? Not so sure. Did some of our regular players not turn up. Yes. Was there a team attitude problem. Yes in part.
    However regardless of if you think we should not panic (I agree) there was some (IMO) things we learnt.
    Welsby is not ready.
    Danny Richardson is not good enough for our team. (Not interested in the final sec kick that’s a distraction) His on field kicking was poor. His drop goal attempt was so DR.
    Amor! Not for me.
    Paulo! Thought he was slowly improving. Very poor and now not sure he will get better.
    Kevin N. Lucky dip which Kevin will turn up.
    Without Coote we lack direction.
    Percy & LMS long way off the pace. Which should have been considered when resting the other 1st team players.
    JH struggles to change a game when it goes wrong.
    JH seems erratic in his sub choices.
    We are top & in a semi but I am slightly concerned JH has not learnt from last season.
    Humans are more concerned with having than being.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 49er View Post
    There are different views about Sunday’s game and apart from the most extreme they all have some validity. Did we lose because of the changes? In part yes. Did we lose because on the day we were out played? Not so sure. Did some of our regular players not turn up. Yes. Was there a team attitude problem. Yes in part.
    However regardless of if you think we should not panic (I agree) there was some (IMO) things we learnt.
    Welsby is not ready.
    Danny Richardson is not good enough for our team. (Not interested in the final sec kick that’s a distraction) His on field kicking was poor. His drop goal attempt was so DR.
    Amor! Not for me.
    Paulo! Thought he was slowly improving. Very poor and now not sure he will get better.
    Kevin N. Lucky dip which Kevin will turn up.
    Without Coote we lack direction.
    Percy & LMS long way off the pace. Which should have been considered when resting the other 1st team players.
    JH struggles to change a game when it goes wrong.
    JH seems erratic in his sub choices.
    We are top & in a semi but I am slightly concerned JH has not learnt from last season.
    Parts of this post are properly annoying me.

    Welsby isn't ready for what? He's been fine in the four or five games he's played so far. Clearly he had a bad game but how on earth does he 'get ready' if we don't let him play through it. Ship him off to a league one club? No thanks. He'll get ready by getting the chance to step in when we rest people or to cover injuries.

    Kevin N hasn't been particularly erratic from week to week. He started very slowly but has been one of our better performers in the last month or two. Pretty consistently as well, although he does seem to miss a few tackles (not sure if the stats back that up).

    To say that Holbrook hasn't learned any lessons from last season is just plain nuts. The criticism last year was all about how knackered we looked, how on earth can you say he's not learned from that given how we've rotated so far this season? Jesus wept.

    There are a few things for the team to learn from that game but Christ we've lost two games all season, while still managing to rotate successfully. Walmsley, Thompson et al are going to be fresh as daisies by the time the business end of the season comes round.

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