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Thread: Saints further strengthen balance sheet

  1. #1
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    Default Saints further strengthen balance sheet

    https://www.saintsrlfc.com/2019/06/0...-and-finances/

    As a shareholders got this information in the post today.

    Sounds good for the long-term - loans conversation to shares with McManus & Colman owning a much bigger percentage.

    Or is it just spin?

    Thoughts of someone with finance background would be appreciated.

    No need for those from over the lump to claim that we are bankrupt whilst their rent arrangements are the future.....

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    Thanks Eamonn.

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    I don’t think even Rogues can spin this negatively. The loans that the club had have been ‘paid off’ as shares in the club. The club is debt free.

    Of course any profit from now on could be paid to shareholders but as long as the business is sustainable this will not be an issue, in fact if it happens regularly and the club remains profitable, it will make the club an attractive investment.

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    I wouldnít swap our set up for anyone elseís in super league.

    We will be forever grateful to our chairman and his associates.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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    To put some actual figures out there. It is a restructuring proposal to convert £9,400,000 of Directors' Secured Loans into 940,000 New Shares.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saint87 View Post
    To put some actual figures out there. It is a restructuring proposal to convert £9,400,000 of Directors' Secured Loans into 940,000 New Shares.
    So that’s 1000 a share. Which they can sell if they want but they will want their investment to succeed. Nothing but good news.

    But we will still be called the Skints by some people

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    Quote Originally Posted by undertheradar View Post
    I wouldnít swap our set up for anyone elseís in super league.

    We will be forever grateful to our chairman and his associates.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


    I will second that

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bostik Bailey View Post
    So that’s 1000 a share. Which they can sell if they want but they will want their investment to succeed. Nothing but good news.

    But we will still be called the Skints by some people
    Think it's actually £10 a share - that's what my documents say anyway.

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    Makes a difference when you have people with the club at heart rather than profit. We really owe a great deal of thanks to those two.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belgian Saint View Post
    Makes a difference when you have people with the club at heart rather than profit. We really owe a great deal of thanks to those two.
    Quite. Iím not the most knowledgeable when it comes to this sort of thing, but this seems like it can only be profoundly good news. When you consider the state we used to be in, to be debt free with multi-million pound asset is pretty amazing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by saint87 View Post
    To put some actual figures out there. It is a restructuring proposal to convert £9,400,000 of Directors' Secured Loans into 940,000 New Shares.
    I,m assuming thats converting a liability to an investment commodity..

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    I would say it’s good news. Converting liabilities such as loans into owners equity should help us with cash flow (liquidity) and we can pay a dividend only where appropriate whereas loans pretty much have to be paid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by STIDDY View Post
    I,m assuming thats converting a liability to an investment commodity..

    In reality it's fairly immaterial, really. The terms of the loan were such that there were no mandatory repayments or interest (IIRC). I suppose it does solidify the investments of EMc and, more especially, Mike Coleman.

    The input of these two cannot be underestimated. They deserve legendary status with the club as much as any of the players. First rescued us from financial uncertainty, then funded the best RL stadium in the country, have rebuilt our status as the best team in SL after a painful and protracted rebuilding process following the retirement of some great players (and yes, they had to learn the hard way on a number of occasions and mistakes were made), and now have secured our future.
    I f*cking hate wi*an.

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    Does this mean we can buy the JJB/DW/WWE and turf Wigan out, using it for promotional stuf?
    Get busy living, or get busy dying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RJM25R View Post
    Does this mean we can buy the JJB/DW/WWE and turf Wigan out, using it for promotional stuf?
    Not sure about that, its the Chernobyl of leftover Pie Crusts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RJM25R View Post
    Does this mean we can buy the JJB/DW/WWE and turf Wigan out, using it for promotional stuf?
    No, I’m sure someone like Rogues would be quick to point out that the Pie Eaters have a 99 year lease (or something long, anyway) BUT we could potentially buy DW plus the stadium and become their landlords...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Bostik Bailey View Post
    I don’t think even Rogues can spin this negatively. The loans that the club had have been ‘paid off’ as shares in the club. The club is debt free.

    Of course any profit from now on could be paid to shareholders but as long as the business is sustainable this will not be an issue, in fact if it happens regularly and the club remains profitable, it will make the club an attractive investment.
    It does appear to be excellent news for the future of the club, as it is debt free, and in due course, I hope a long time off, the shares can be sold off in smaller parcels to future investors in the club, so instead of relying on two owners, who as others have said have done wonders for the club, perhaps other local benefactors can take up the mantle and continue the success. However, it also needs bums on seats and yesterday's attendance was poor. Hands up the people on here who did not go, just because it was on television. The players can't hear you in your living room or the pub, they can only hear you on the terraces.
    Last edited by Woolyback; 2nd June 2019 at 08:48.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woolyback View Post
    It does appear to be excellent news for the future of the club, as it is debt free, and in due course, I hope a long time off, the shares can be sold off in smaller parcels to future investors in the club, so instead of relying on two owners, who as others have said have done wonders for the club, perhaps other local benefactors can take up the mantle and continue the success. However, it also needs bums on seats and yesterday's attendance was poor. Hands up the people on here who did not go, just because it was on television. The players can't hear you in your living room or the pub, they can only hear you on the terraces.
    Attendances at Challenge Cup games have been low for a number of years now - itís not just an issue for Saints itís an issue for the game as a whole. I havenít been able to find the attendance figures for the two previous quarter finals involving the two Hull sides but I bet ours was the biggest?

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    From a finance background it's a mix of two things:

    1) A show of long term commitment to the club and also a view that it will grow and prosper going forward (after all equity is at risk of overall club performance, whereas the loans were being repaid and carrying interest).

    2) It's a massive boost to the financial underpinnings of the club, as no longer do those loans (plus interest) have to be repaid on a (presumably monthly) basis - these can often be a significant drain on the club, after all there's no ongoing benefit to the club of those loan funds going out (other than paying for wages, or investing in facilities etc).

    It secures the future and frees up cash flow that can be utilised for stuff with direct, specific benefit to the club, such as the upcoming reserve grade for Super League (ex Catalans) - there's a real chance that could prove a significant burden on many clubs, especially if the gate receipts stay very low for those games (or if the matches remain as curtain-raisers to the main event).

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    It is a great contribution from our main investors. Possibly showing faith in the club making future profits, but more likely an endowment to benefit the club long term.

    The players and coaches get the sporting glory but this is a true investment in a business that is incredibly high risk as Leeds are finding out this year and as other clubs have found out in the past.

    The millions poured into the club may not carry the glamour of a koucash offering £1m to a specific celebrity player, but it is a bigger and more substantial gesture and supports a club long term.

    Credit to them as given the debt we were in we could easily have fallen into the cas or wakey class of clubs unable to get out of our older ground and make a new start.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woolyback View Post
    It does appear to be excellent news for the future of the club, as it is debt free, and in due course, I hope a long time off, the shares can be sold off in smaller parcels to future investors in the club, so instead of relying on two owners, who as others have said have done wonders for the club, perhaps other local benefactors can take up the mantle and continue the success. However, it also needs bums on seats and yesterday's attendance was poor. Hands up the people on here who did not go, just because it was on television. The players can't hear you in your living room or the pub, they can only hear you on the terraces.
    It's a fair call I think.

    You can make all the excuses you want but people should get off their backsides & go.

    And yeah last week, I didn't go and probably could have made it in the end. So hands up for last week but it was a must win yesterday and I made sure I went.

    I don't know what the people of this town want at all. We might not win anything, which would be hard to take but we are great to watch.

    If I was a player I would be pretty unhappy with the turnout from the supporters yesterday.

    I've had a fair few debates with Upside on the marketing and promotion of the sport. I got home last night & I thought you know what, Upside is right. You can't do much more when the fans aren't bothered.

    And just to clarify, I have been guilty of this apathy too. I've picked my matches at times. If that's the mentality of thousands of others, then the sport will never progress
    Dave Woods: the guy who makes Eddie Hemmings look like a decent commentator

  22. #22
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    It was a poor crowd yesterday but donít forget how many Saints fans were in the Kop last weekend. For many I suspect it will have been a financial choice between two events that donít come under the membership.

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    In school half term with many people away.

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    When it was changed to later in the season and the most publicity given to the Sky final people started to loose interest , if things don't need changing then don't.

  25. #25
    WARNING! PIE EATER!

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    It appears that it is very good news for, BUT you'll have to wait until the accounts are published to see the full effect. Last year I got slated on here for saying the McManus had said that Saints were due to make a profit in 2018, I think my remark was "I think we've heard that before"
    http://forums.redvee.net/showthread....profit-in-2018

    The last published accounts showed (for 2017) showed that Saints still owed £20 million, so to write half of that off is good news.

    https://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/d...4b7502d4ff39ae

    As for attendances, the whole game is in a mess at the moment. I had a good discussion with an agent and a superleague junior coach last Saturday at Anfield, and they are "concerned" about how the game is moving.

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