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Thread: England v Australia

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    All fair points. The lack of good centres and, for that matter, half backs is a problem.
    That has been the difference for the last forty years,we can always match them up front,in fact i reckon our pack is better,we have never had better centres half backs for that amount of time,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris1964 View Post
    That has been the difference for the last forty years,we can always match them up front,in fact i reckon our pack is better,we have never had better centres half backs for that amount of time,
    I wonder what we are doing wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    I wonder what we are doing wrong
    I don't know,but it's a fact,you can go through every Australian team and their halves and centres were just Proper World Class,not the Legends we throw about for very good Super League players,two examples Long Newlove very very good domestic players,couldn't hack it at International level consistently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    I wonder what we are doing wrong
    Picking from a tiny pool across the M62? No reserve grade now for kids to have a shot? Poor pathways after academy? There's a small list before we go further into the culture difference and the fact we don't give young halves a chance

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris1964 View Post
    I don't know,but it's a fact,you can go through every Australian team and their halves and centres were just Proper World Class,not the Legends we throw about for very good Super League players,two examples Long Newlove very very good domestic players,couldn't hack it at International level consistently.
    Pretty harsh on Newlove that. He shone against the Australians and Kiwis on a number of occasions. A truly world class player IMO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    Pretty harsh on Newlove that. He shone against the Australians and Kiwis on a number of occasions. A truly world class player IMO.
    Yep, I'd agree with that. If he had a problem at international level it's that too often he wasn't available for selection (not unlike KC). But when he played he more than held his own. A series that springs to mind is one in which he had a tough battle with Ettingshausen over three matches and (I think) got the better of him. '97, I think it might have been.

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    IMO the Australian team gets weaker every few years. I can’t believe Klemmer and Woods are the starting props for Friday!! They are sh**!! Plenty of the current Ozzy squad aren’t a patch on the players of 20 years ago when they had the likes of Clyde, Webke, Johns, Fittler, Ettinghausen, Meninga to name a few.
    The Australian media seems to big them up every season ignoring the fact that these so called invinsible players like Slater, Smith, Thurston have lost to the Kiwis in numerous finals over the past decade.

    It makes it all the more depressing that we don’t seem to be closing the gap on them.
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  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    Yep, I'd agree with that. If he had a problem at international level it's that too often he wasn't available for selection (not unlike KC). But when he played he more than held his own. A series that springs to mind is one in which he had a tough battle with Ettingshausen over three matches and (I think) got the better of him. '97, I think it might have been.
    Yeh i agree. I remember the kiwi series of 1998 when he broke and created a try for Senior then 5 minutes later scored himself single handedly getting gt britain back into the game.
    He shone in numerous other international games for England and outplayed every centre he played against for Saints in the 1997 WCC games.
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  9. #34
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    Personally speaking, I prefer my 4 to be an attacking centre but don’t mind if my 3 is more defensive minded. With Watkins playing on the right, most of the attacking play that would go down the left will stop at Bateman. He simply doesn’t have the handling skills to play centre. My prediction is that he will bomb 2 or 3 tries a game whilst he is wearing the 4 shirt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    Yep, I'd agree with that. If he had a problem at international level it's that too often he wasn't available for selection (not unlike KC). But when he played he more than held his own. A series that springs to mind is one in which he had a tough battle with Ettingshausen over three matches and (I think) got the better of him. '97, I think it might have been.
    He played 14 times for GB against NZ and Australia scored 4 tries,4 times for England against NZ and Australia scored 2 so 18 times and scored 6 not exactly World Class centre play,don't get me wrong him and Sculthorpe were my two favourite players for Saints

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    Congratulations to Walmsley, Lomax and Roby for making the match squad and good luck. Regarding some of the posts on here about Percival not progressing this year shows up the fan who watches the games home and away and the arm chair fan. His performances and statistics this year have been up there with the very best. Errors have been mentioned but look at the table for errors last year it is the players who are the go to men at each club hence they come up with more errors as they are fed the ball in attacking areas and try to create, for example Fonau at Hull. To pick Bateman in front of him is ludicrous. Percival has learned from his experience in the four nations but how is he supposed to show this or test himself if he is dragged around the world twice in a year to be not picked and a player who does not play centre picked before him. I bet the lad is wondering what he has to do!!

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trent View Post
    Congratulations to Walmsley, Lomax and Roby for making the match squad and good luck. Regarding some of the posts on here about Percival not progressing this year shows up the fan who watches the games home and away and the arm chair fan. His performances and statistics this year have been up there with the very best. Errors have been mentioned but look at the table for errors last year it is the players who are the go to men at each club hence they come up with more errors as they are fed the ball in attacking areas and try to create, for example Fonau at Hull. To pick Bateman in front of him is ludicrous. Percival has learned from his experience in the four nations but how is he supposed to show this or test himself if he is dragged around the world twice in a year to be not picked and a player who does not play centre picked before him. I bet the lad is wondering what he has to do!!

    I agree Percival should play and I rate him highly. However you can't just dismiss someone as an armchair fan purely because they have a different opinion to you.
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    It just doesn't make sense to me ,why play a second row forward at centre when there isn't any injuries ,I don't think Bateman will let us down but he won't be a world beater ,Percival if he has a problem is he never seems to feed his winger at the right time that apart he is class , seems to me we have a coach that's not seen his players playing live and I definitely think he is lacking in pride for our game

  14. #39
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    Fair enough, however still struggle to understand a fan who has been to the games home and away can come the conclusion he has not progressed this year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trent View Post
    Congratulations to Walmsley, Lomax and Roby for making the match squad and good luck. Regarding some of the posts on here about Percival not progressing this year shows up the fan who watches the games home and away and the arm chair fan. His performances and statistics this year have been up there with the very best. Errors have been mentioned but look at the table for errors last year it is the players who are the go to men at each club hence they come up with more errors as they are fed the ball in attacking areas and try to create, for example Fonau at Hull. To pick Bateman in front of him is ludicrous. Percival has learned from his experience in the four nations but how is he supposed to show this or test himself if he is dragged around the world twice in a year to be not picked and a player who does not play centre picked before him. I bet the lad is wondering what he has to do!!
    If he doesn't get a game in this World Cup and Bennet is still the boss I should imagine Percy will be looking for a Scottish or Welsh Ancestor.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasty View Post
    I wonder what we are doing wrong
    Yesterday, I was watching the highlights of Saints juniors beating the Aussie kids and thinking the same thing.

  17. #42
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    I think Percy will get a game or two to impress. I can understand the caution to an extent as he has had a wobbly game or two for England. If he impresses then maybe he’ll get a run later in the tournament.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    Pretty harsh on Newlove that. He shone against the Australians and Kiwis on a number of occasions. A truly world class player IMO.
    Newlove's best years were during the Super League war, not a good time for international RL. He had a good game in the opening game of the 1995 World Cup.
    I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Prez View Post
    Spot on. You won't beat the Aussies in the "grind", so don't try. We've got to be more creative. Bateman isn't a creative player, end of.
    Why is do people assume we are going to grind. I am hoping the plan is to make it a physical game. Blood and Pain is the way.

    No joking around at the scrums having a laugh and no handbags 10 mins from the end when it is all over.

    Physical in defence, dynamic ball play in the middle. Once we are on the front foot, quick balls out wide.

    There are no players to fear in the Australia team. We just need to beat them down, then defeat them.
    I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    Pretty harsh on Newlove that. He shone against the Australians and Kiwis on a number of occasions. A truly world class player IMO.
    Agreed.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    There's your problem, right there. By using a second rower in the centres you have taken away much of your creativity out wide so when that ball goes out there it dies with Bateman. It would die with Bateman at centre against a Super League defence. It will certainly do so against the Aussies. The selection of Bateman at centre for England is the equivalent of LMS at centre for Saints. Square peggery.
    I am aware of the Bridget Jones underwear scenario here. However we have two centre wing combos. We can have our cake and eat it. Watkins will do the job. If our pack do what they need to do then it should just be a case of finishing of the moves with a fall over. As for the other side we just need to keep Josh Duggan quiet.
    I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fishy3005 View Post
    Pretty harsh on Newlove that. He shone against the Australians and Kiwis on a number of occasions. A truly world class player IMO.
    Connolly was up at that top level, too.

    But I'd agree that those two were the last. It wasn't long after when we'd pin our hopes on Keith bloody Senior coming up with a half-break. No wonder we've struggled.

  23. #48
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    A great post I found on another forum...

    "If Wayne Bennett's knowledge on the game is an ocean, by comparison people on here, their knowledge is a grain of sand.

    And yet we have people stating we should "try something different, throw the ball around a bit". Yeah, great, I'm sure Bennett is taking tips."
    I could agree with you but then we would both be wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noel Cleal View Post
    A great post I found on another forum...

    "If Wayne Bennett's knowledge on the game is an ocean, by comparison people on here, their knowledge is a grain of sand.

    And yet we have people stating we should "try something different, throw the ball around a bit". Yeah, great, I'm sure Bennett is taking tips."
    I don't rate the guy. Don't like the guy. He isn't the answer

  25. #50
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    To be fair to Bennett I suspect he is doing a bit of damage limitation early on in the comp.However I believe the best time to beat the aussies is in the first game and it may be a mistake to go on the defensive initially? We will have to wait and see.
    Learned comment from The Don

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