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Thread: Keirons Conundrum

  1. #101
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    We boast about having a good academy setup and we have we won there championship last year unbeaten all season and the lad Richardson kept his cool at the end of the final , give the lad his chance tell him he is playing until first choice man comes back and longer if he is playing so well and tell the teammates that he is going to be playing with " this lad is going to be shouting and take notice of him after all he has been trained for the job , alternatively tell him we don't think you will be good enough to keep a veteran second row forward out of your position so you might as well think about were you are going next year.

  2. #102
    Learning All The Songs MancSaint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Div View Post
    2017 and still considering Wilkin as an option at 7 . Beggars belief.
    This.This.This.

    Feels like this scenario has been going on for an eternity.

    The teat is dry KC. Stop sucking it.

  3. #103
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    I would just like at the time of writing (for writing sounds more intellectual than typing) KC has not said that he will run with Wilkin / Lee and not Richardson. We will only know when Thursday week arrives, so it's a little unfair at the moment to hang out of him. Indeed some even think Wilkin should play in 'that position'. So I think it's only fair we hold off until then, and even then should we not hold off until after the Leeds game, before making comment on KC's choices. Whatever his choice for the Leeds game we should respect (even if we personnaly don't agree), certainly until we see how it plays out.
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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Webbo Again View Post
    Flanagan - the halfback hero of 2014 - is sadly no longer at the club.

    Not to go off too much on a tangent: but this is an interesting point. Never really understood why he went because he did a decent job for us I thought (unless he wanted to leave)?

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by 49er View Post
    I would just like at the time of writing (for writing sounds more intellectual than typing) KC has not said that he will run with Wilkin / Lee and not Richardson. We will only know when Thursday week arrives, so it's a little unfair at the moment to hang out of him. Indeed some even think Wilkin should play in 'that position'. So I think it's only fair we hold off until then, and even then should we not hold off until after the Leeds game, before making comment on KC's choices. Whatever his choice for the Leeds game we should respect (even if we personnaly don't agree), certainly until we see how it plays out.
    I don't see it as unfair to critisise - manly due to the fact that many posters on here have said we needed more cover at HB for months now.
    Obviously we didn't expect the injury curse to strike so early - but to go into a season with only Smith as an established HB and Fages still in the up and coming bracket was ludicrous.

    But despite this KC's obsession with signing more forwards was unrelenting - even up until our most recent rumoured targets.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by yogi bear View Post
    I don't see it as unfair to critisise - manly due to the fact that many posters on here have said we needed more cover at HB for months now.
    Obviously we didn't expect the injury curse to strike so early - but to go into a season with only Smith as an established HB and Fages still in the up and coming bracket was ludicrous.
    But despite this KC's obsession with signing more forwards was unrelenting - even up until our most recent rumoured targets.
    I can't argue with what you say, but I do try and look at it from all angles. I'm not sure the HB situation would be an issue if Smith was fit. Rightly or wrongly KC may, and I stress may (I don't know his mind) have thought Smith, Fages, Richardson and if s### hits fan use Wilkin and at a stretch Lee to fill in for the odd game, for the odd suspension, rest or minor injury.
    You might be right 'now' but like the under-study for Robes, who would come to Saints as an out and out HB who is a great player and is willing to sit on his hands if Smith was fit? (Hindsight is wonderful) I for one would not want a player coming to Saints who does not care if he plays or not.
    It's opinions and we all have them. It makes for a nice debate. Who knows KC may see it your way and be looking for a back up.
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  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by RV12 View Post
    Here's what KC said a couple of weeks ago:

    "Danny has been outstanding and he will get a chance this year. You can’t hold players back for the sake of it. If they are ready to go and are going to make you a better team then you have to give them a shot. If young Theo goes down, Danny is going to drop straight in."

    I know that you shouldn't take anything KC says too literally, but he doesn't say that Richardson would could in if Matty Smith got injured. However, his comments do say that he is ready for first team rugby.

    As others have pointed out, our rivals would take the chance on a young player. If Leuluai gets injured at Wigan then Shorrocks would come in and not O Loughlin, if (when) Brown gets injured at Wire, Patton would come in and nor Ratchford, if (when) Walsh gets injured at Catalans, Albert comes in and not Gigot.

    I am limited in how far I can comment, as I've never seen Richardson play. However, KC seems to think that he's ready, and if at the age of 20, and our scrum half gets injured, and we choose to play a 32 year old loose forward at scrum half ahead of him, then you have to ask why Richardson is at the club as we mustn't rate him too highly.

    I would give him a chance. Assuming he's stood out in the reserves, and works hard in training, then he deserves his chance. If it doesn't work, then Wilkin can drop in. But sometimes taking the risk and giving a young player a chance can really benefit the team. Briers is a good example, the Lomax/Gaskell partnership nearly got us a championship, Eastmond and Percival had great starts to their careers too, because we took the chance and threw them in.

    It's a big call for KC, and I could understand his reasons for either decision, but that's why he's paid his wages, and I suppose he'll be judged by the result next Thursday, and in the weeks after.
    A very cheap comment for Cunningham to make before he didn't have to put his money where his mouth is following Smith's injury.
    Let's wait and see if it was just yet another load of crap the guy spouts
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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by 49er View Post
    I can't argue with what you say, but I do try and look at it from all angles. I'm not sure the HB situation would be an issue if Smith was fit. Rightly or wrongly KC may, and I stress may (I don't know his mind) have thought Smith, Fages, Richardson and if s### hits fan use Wilkin and at a stretch Lee to fill in for the odd game, for the odd suspension, rest or minor injury.
    You might be right 'now' but like the under-study for Robes, who would come to Saints as an out and out HB who is a great player and is willing to sit on his hands if Smith was fit? (Hindsight is wonderful) I for one would not want a player coming to Saints who does not care if he plays or not.
    It's opinions and we all have them. It makes for a nice debate. Who knows KC may see it your way and be looking for a back up.
    In my opinion we have been screaming out for someone who can cover 6/7/9 adequately for several years - like Burrow has done at Leeds, I imagine TL will do the same at Wigan again.

  9. #109
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    Whilst I'm sure we'd all like to see something new and exciting, I still haven't read anything to convince me that Danny Richardson should be thrown in at the deep end for this game.

    Sure, youngsters have to start somewhere and a young prop or a winger in a big game, I can get my head around. Indeed I can get my head around a half back making a debut in a big game if the person next to him is a leader, who can nurture him and guide him through the game. However, to play the totally inexperienced Richardson alongside a Theo Fages who is like a fish out of water himself when not next to somebody to guide him around, would be the most naive tactical blunder I've seen for a very long time.

    Quite simply, they'd murder us in the halves and we'd end up lucky to score zip.

    Clearly, nobody really wants to see Wilkin there long term but for a game like this, we're going to need experience in the halves. I know little about Richardson, and the fact that I don't suggests he is no Eastmond yet, but what I do know about Fages is that he is no leader. Our rivals may take a chance on a young player now and again, but they don't throw in a totally inexperienced half back alongside one not much more experienced, who totally flatters to deceive when asked to take charge.

    For me, it's a non-starter.

    Much more tempting would be shifting Jonny Lomax into the halves and playing Makinson at full back. We'd get much more creativity into the side that way, but I just don't think this is on KC's radar.
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    Sure, youngsters have to start somewhere and a young prop or a winger in a big game, I can get my head around. Indeed I can get my head around a half back making a debut in a big game if the person next to him is a leader, who can nurture him and guide him through the game. However, to play the totally inexperienced Richardson alongside a Theo Fages who is like a fish out of water himself when not next to somebody to guide him around, would be the most naive tactical blunder I've seen for a very long time.

    Quite simply, they'd murder us in the halves and we'd end up lucky to score zip.

    Clearly, nobody really wants to see Wilkin there long term but for a game like this, we're going to need experience in the halves. I know little about Richardson, and the fact that I don't suggests he is no Eastmond yet, but what I do know about Fages is that he is no leader. Our rivals may take a chance on a young player now and again, but they don't throw in a totally inexperienced half back alongside one not much more experienced, who totally flatters to deceive when asked to take charge.

    For me, it's a non-starter.

    Much more tempting would be shifting Jonny Lomax into the halves and playing Makinson at full back. We'd get much more creativity into the side that way, but I just don't think this is on KC's radar.[/QUOTE]
    Totally realistic and correct. Regarding Lomax yes personally I think he would do a great job at scrum half but his tactical kicking is not the best.

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    If this isn't a good time to put Richardson in then I don't know when is?


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    Having seen the highlights from the weekend it seems I did DR a disservice by suggesting that he may have been at fault for Cas's second try. Looks as though he was already off by then, and it's clearly Peyroux who bites.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    Having seen the highlights from the weekend it seems I did DR a disservice by suggesting that he may have been at fault for Cas's second try. Looks as though he was already off by then, and it's clearly Peyroux who bites.
    Did you see what Peyroux did in the lead up to their first try? He's a joke

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  14. #114
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    Default Keirons Conundrum

    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    Did you see what Peyroux did in the lead up to their first try? He's a joke

    Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk
    Yeah, I was shaking my head at that when I was at the game. Hadn't noticed his role in the second try though. His handling was poor as well, so not a good outing for him.

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    Think Dom got mom from Daryl Powell.

  16. #116
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    Where have the highlights been posted?
    NEVER WRITE OFF THE SAINTS

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Yellow Giraffe View Post
    Where have the highlights been posted?
    In the Cas highlights thread. Few posts down from the retro video.

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    Do not forget Dom is a fans favourite so he will no doubt be in the 17 for the Leeds game. I presume he is not taking up a big slice of the cap but he does seem a liability to most of us. Ball in hand I have seen worse but in defence he takes some beating for avoiding contact, he certainly wont be retiring with a back injury.

    Everyone seems to presume it will be Farges +1 at half back but couldn't it just as easily be Richardson + 1? and that could fit with Lomax at 6.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    In the Cas highlights thread. Few posts down from the retro video.
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  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    Having seen the highlights from the weekend it seems I did DR a disservice by suggesting that he may have been at fault for Cas's second try. Looks as though he was already off by then, and it's clearly Peyroux who bites.
    Yes poor defensive reads from him and Fleming for Cas 2nd 3rd and 4th tries. First try Fages slipped on the bad surface, don,t know what's going on with that pitch divots all over the pitch and it's not as though we,be had a lot of rainfall.

  21. #121
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    The conundrum is not as big an issue as portrayed.

    We have a squad that should be capable of getting in the top 4 regardless of the MS injury. Get there and it is a straight shoot out for the GF. Ok may be away but not sure that mAkes much difference these days and no benefit of a second chance any more from finishing top

    Lose so what. Look at leeds in their glory years. Early season form was shocking.

    Dont agree with this approach but thats what " every second counts" leads to these days

  22. #122
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    i would with richardson and fages in the first halve see how thats going if not well put wilkin in there he's not the best at 7 but i think he does an ok job there for a few weeks if it's only for 1 halve gives the youngsters a go and will take him out off the spot light for the rest of the game if he struggles

  23. #123
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    I was sitting next to Kyle at the pre season dinner and I asked him who the starting half backs would be v Leeds. He said that he didn't have a clue

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    We are dreadfully short in the halfbacks. But after being at the game on Sunday, and just watching the tries we conceded. I think Fleming has proven once again he is anything but a centre. Not much pace, weak in defence.

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    Saints have had some cruel luck at halfback in recent years & to lose your main halfback we've trained with all off season a week before the season starts epitomises that. After watching the Cas game I don't think it would be a bad thing to start Wilkin at scrum half. Irrespective of where he's named on the team sheet we will split the halves either side of the ruck & Wilkin even at loose forward willl get a lot of ball through his hands so it makes little difference. Like it or not he will be dictating play wherever he plays next Thursday if it placates people being named 13 so be it.
    Tommy Lee was awful last week, the two crash balls second half losing possession surely rules him out of the equation. If Richardson starts it's a gamble, and on game one we may go a different way but that doesn't mean he's forgotten about. Long season ahead for him to develop further and get first team opportunities.


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