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View Poll Results: Will we make the Top 4

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  • Yes

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Thread: Will we make the Top 4

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blobbynator View Post
    Finishing 4th would be deemed a success of a season by the club and that there lies the whole problem. We no longer have a culture of winning. Our season is not deemed a success on winning a trophy it is finishing 4th in the league and for a club of this size, resources and tradition that is simply not good enough in my view.

    When we were at our best in the early to mid 2000's a poor season was considered not winning a trophy. In 2007 we finished top and won the cup but lost the Grand Final and there was a slight air of disappointment around the club that we didn't win the lot again. Since then our standards have slipped and expectations have slowly deteriorated. It's gone from winning trophies to reaching finals, from reaching finals to reaching semi finals, from reaching semi finals to finishing 4th. What's next - Finishing in the top 8?

    Finishing 4th for me would not be a good season and it would just paper over the cracks once again as the "club meets it target" and would allow more substandard recruitment until we eventually get left behind by more clubs, finish even further down the league and only then will the club actually wake up and realise "Oh wait, we best do something now and sign better quality players!".
    But herein lies the problem for supporters. In the first half of the season it was nailed on that we would not be in the top 8 and would find ourselves scrabbling in the middle 8's - that now falls to Leeds and Huddersfield. We now find ourselves with all still to play for, although sense dictates that we will not qualify. However, until that time arises, the Saints need our full support, particularly at home games. Yes, we have had an uncomfortable few years, but rest assured that the Club will do what is necessary to rectify this malaise. Keep the faith.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Yellow Giraffe View Post
    The last bit is bang on; there's nothing like a trip to Wigan to unite us all and allow us to put things to one side for 80 minutes. Despite what's gone on over the last 18 months, I really can't wait for Friday.
    Totally agree,I can't wait for Friday,I just wish we were at home,I hate the Pie Dome,though the atmosphere in the away end is always fantastic,fingers crossed we beat them,and carry on our unbeaten run.y

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by superarch View Post
    Yes, we have had an uncomfortable few years, but rest assured that the Club will do what is necessary to rectify this malaise. Keep the faith.
    Hmmm. We haven't had an exciting team for about ten years. We've slowly slid for the best part of a decade, with the 2014 GF win a significant spike in the downward trend. You're speaking like we've just come across some discontent, and that the club will sort stuff out. This has been happening for a good while, and the club have continually shown that not only are they not going to sort it out, but that they don't actually think there is anything to actually sort out in the first place. Look at the recruitment in the last five years, look at the decision to give KC a contract extension based on an average season. Take a look at the crowds, and take a look at the bunker mentality that emanates from the club in it's communications with its fans. And you think this is a club that will 'rectify this malaise'? I admire you're positivity.

  4. #104
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    Let's all be clear here we all want Saints to do well but as fans we have almost a duty to point out when things are not right.It will be difficult to stay in the top 4 if we get there and the issue arises from the last 18 months after we were champs because of recruitment and the appointment of an inexperienced coach.I have nothing against KC personally and watched most of his games as a legendary player but I have seen some other good ones in 50 years.

    If he stops coming out with the drivel in the press and learns some man management skills he might yet turn everything around but the style of play is very important to saints fans and we want to be entertained otherwise crowds would not have dropped since 2014.

    It is clear to me whatever the number of the crowd that is announced it is way over the number who are there.I know many ST holders who don't bother at the moment which is a cause for real concern.

    I have no inside knowledge of the club and I really hope that someone does have a handle on the problems and knows what the plans are because I cannot see any and I can't see much improvement in the style of play although against the last few teams there has been some promise.As an earlier poster said friday is a real test and if we can continue to improve we will have a chance but we must grasp the nettle and play a bit of RL and not stick with the grind.Maybe the better pitches will assist.Certainly we look a lot better with Walsh fit and firing and generally playing a bit smarter.

    As said before recruitment is absolutely key and managing our promising youngsters.
    Learned comment from The Don

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by superarch View Post
    But herein lies the problem for supporters. In the first half of the season it was nailed on that we would not be in the top 8 and would find ourselves scrabbling in the middle 8's - that now falls to Leeds and Huddersfield. We now find ourselves with all still to play for, although sense dictates that we will not qualify. However, until that time arises, the Saints need our full support, particularly at home games. Yes, we have had an uncomfortable few years, but rest assured that the Club will do what is necessary to rectify this malaise. Keep the faith.
    I agree with this completely. It's one of those where I can see both sides of the argument, but ultimately the issue lies with recruitment for me. Whether we win the competition or win less than half our fixtures in the next phase, we need to address certain issues within the squad and head into next season looking stronger. We've all heard the names, guys who are coming in and those going out but ultimately we have to wait and see what happens and where we are at. The club are aware of what the fans think. We have to hope that we do get the right players and that has to been the aim no matter where we finish.

    Cunningham has plenty to learn, don't get me wrong. He's gone from one extreme to the other with regards to how he's handled the media and the way he has handled certain situations hasn't been ideal. He's young though and that's why I would have liked to have seen someone with a little bit of experience come in alongside him, although I can see the issues that may arise with that. Recruitment has absolutely been an issue though. We've signed some average players, whilst some who appeared like decent signings at the time just haven't come off. Some of that is the clubs fault, some the players themselves but with the league being how it is right now, beating teams around you to a couple of high quality players will make such a difference to a season.

    I agree with Don though, lack of pace has been such an issue for us. Our forwards have done a decent job IMO and we've had ample field position in most games we've played, we just haven't had the pace on the flanks to make the most of it. Now we've got a full fit back line with Lomax at 1, we are starting to look a little bit more threatening with the ball and are able to attack with more width. That was an issue early in the year IMO. Walsh would have the ball in hands and would see Dom Peyroux and Jack Owens outside him with Shannon McDonnell out the back, neither of which are going to beat a man The Catalan game was the most frustrated I've been for a long time because we created so many opportunities and overlaps but Dawson and Owens bombed them. In reality what should have been a try or a break turned into another one out carry. Our right edge has been as much use as a chocolate tee pot for most of this season and we've had Percival, Swift and Lomax on the other side injured for long periods as well. I'm not making excuses but I do think that lack of threat has impacted the style of rugby we have played.

    The challenge for us is making the semi finals. We'll give anyone a game on our day and we have performances in us, but making the four at the end of the 8's will be our biggest challenge. On Friday we go to Wigan and like many I'm already looking forward to it. Wigan away is the stand out fixture of the season for me, the atmosphere, the excitement in the build up, it's how sport should feel. No matter what is going on in our season, whenever we play at Wigan it's always an occasion and we always get behind the players. I've no doubt that will be the same on Friday night.
    Steve Prescott MBE (1973-2013)
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  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    Agreed. I'd much rather we gave youth a go than sign Tommy Lee for example. But there's a difficulty in defining what 'giving it a good go' entails. Last year we had a very close semi-final with the eventual treble winners. Is that giving it a good go? Maybe, maybe not since we were just as rubbish as we are this year on numerous occasions last year.


    What I mean by give it a go is play attacking, entertaining rugby. The Saints way!

    The 2014 GF win & last year's semi just indicate the poor standard of competition, which makes it all the more frustrating, as even with the dross we have in the squad, we still have enough decent players to stand a chance if we got shut of KC.

  7. #107
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    I know KC has copped a lot of flack on here but most of it is constructive from seasoned saints fans. There were so many things that could improve our game with simple issues here's 3
    1 Kicking the ball more than 10 yards from a free kick
    2 Running at gaps and not defenders
    3 Forwards running in pairs (not on their own) to confuse defences

    All of these are simple adjustments.If I can see these and I have no coaching qualifications why don't our coaching staff.JT has referred to having the shackles removed....why the hell were there shackles on in the first place?

    As I have said before if we weren't playing with shackles on we would be in the top 4 now and planning a wembley trip.

    However on friday it's COYS.
    Learned comment from The Don

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post
    Hmmm. We haven't had an exciting team for about ten years. We've slowly slid for the best part of a decade, with the 2014 GF win a significant spike in the downward trend. You're speaking like we've just come across some discontent, and that the club will sort stuff out. This has been happening for a good while, and the club have continually shown that not only are they not going to sort it out, but that they don't actually think there is anything to actually sort out in the first place. Look at the recruitment in the last five years, look at the decision to give KC a contract extension based on an average season. Take a look at the crowds, and take a look at the bunker mentality that emanates from the club in it's communications with its fans. And you think this is a club that will 'rectify this malaise'? I admire you're positivity.
    My uncomfortable few years go back to when Talau was released. Since then the spiral downward in quality signings has been alarming. However, the undoubted need to create a new stadium maybe caused a few to take their eye off the ball - A world class team to suit a world class stadium? springs to mind. But we have now reached a cross roads and I expect the club will take measures to set us back on track.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouse Don View Post
    I know KC has copped a lot of flack on here but most of it is constructive from seasoned saints fans. There were so many things that could improve our game with simple issues here's 3
    1 Kicking the ball more than 10 yards from a free kick
    2 Running at gaps and not defenders
    3 Forwards running in pairs (not on their own) to confuse defences

    All of these are simple adjustments.If I can see these and I have no coaching qualifications why don't our coaching staff.JT has referred to having the shackles removed....why the hell were there shackles on in the first place?

    As I have said before if we weren't playing with shackles on we would be in the top 4 now and planning a wembley trip.

    However on friday it's COYS.
    Spot on Don ,

    I thought it was only me that noticed we only make about 10 yards from a free kick when surely 30 yards + is obtainable
    for any kicker .
    That extra 20 yards is worth an extra 2 tackles !

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scouse Don View Post
    I know KC has copped a lot of flack on here but most of it is constructive from seasoned saints fans. There were so many things that could improve our game with simple issues here's 3
    1 Kicking the ball more than 10 yards from a free kick
    2 Running at gaps and not defenders
    3 Forwards running in pairs (not on their own) to confuse defences

    All of these are simple adjustments.If I can see these and I have no coaching qualifications why don't our coaching staff.JT has referred to having the shackles removed....why the hell were there shackles on in the first place?

    As I have said before if we weren't playing with shackles on we would be in the top 4 now and planning a wembley trip.

    However on friday it's COYS.
    Spot on. In a different thread, this "shackles" thing has been mentioned before, and I, like you asked the question "Who put the shackles on?".

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    I reckon if I started this thread today we would see a different response ha.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ptb View Post
    I reckon if I started this thread today we would see a different response ha.
    I would still be amongst the six!

  13. #113
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    88.89% were wrong!

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    How do you know, it hasn't happened yet? There are still seven games to go.

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    The challenge cup will be a big distraction for four of the other teams as well.

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    Huge result for Saints today. Gives us away games at Wire, Wigan and Widnes, all of whom we beat away this season, plus an extra home game to boost the coffers ahead of our big signings next year! We should make the play offs now and then it's two games to win the whole thing and it's anyone's. Ridiculous if we even get close given how poor we've been, but that's Super League in 2016

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    I hate to say it but we're possibly getting a little ahead of ourselves. Yes the fixtures look favourable but we all thought that when we opened last year's Super 8s with home games against Hull and Huddersfield. We lost them both and couldn't buy a win in the 8s for weeks. We need to focus less on who we are playing against and more on replicating the level of performance seen at Wigan on a consistent basis. If we revert to old habits we'll have no chance.
    Don't be pessimistic now, Stephen. Doesn't suit you

    I know what you're getting at but we are undoubtedly showing improvement, especially defensively. Replicate and continue to improve performances and I'd go beyond thinking there's nothing to fear in this league, I'd actually suggest it's there for the taking. Hull will be incredibly nervous the closer they get and we've already knocked over both Wire and Wigan on their own patches.

    I honestly don't know how, whether luck or not, but we've somehow managed to put ourselves in a decent spot. I just hope our lads stay fit and we can continue to build fluency.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    I hate to say it but we're possibly getting a little ahead of ourselves. Yes the fixtures look favourable but we all thought that when we opened last year's Super 8s with home games against Hull and Huddersfield. We lost them both and couldn't buy a win in the 8s for weeks. We need to focus less on who we are playing against and more on replicating the level of performance seen at Wigan on a consistent basis. If we revert to old habits we'll have no chance.
    Agreed. The pivotal fixture is obviously Catalan at home. On current form it's hard to see Catalans winning more than 4 out of 7 but it's all on paper at the moment

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    I certainly hope I'm wrong and you're right, which wouldn't be all that remarkable. I'm just not convinced we've suddenly become able to beat the top sides consistently. However if we win it I'll celebrate wildly and heap praise upon all involved. There'll be no tired metaphors about paper and cracks. Though other tired metaphors are available.
    That's the beauty of this season I'd say though: inconsistency.

    I don't think there's a side in the country with a consistent ability to beat the top sides. They're all much of a muchness. It'll come down to which side can be consistent when it matters and we've done pretty well in that regard over the last month. Those fixtures we've got give us a nice opportunity to maintain a decent run of form as well I reckon. Much better placed than I feared we'd be a few weeks ago.

  20. #120
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    4 points clear of Catalan now. Depending on wires results we could go 2nd next week.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

  21. #121
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    Polyfilla anyone?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS View Post
    I just hope our lads stay fit and we can continue to build fluency.
    Exactly. We keep the squad fit, no reason we can't get to Old Trafford. Where other teams seem to be looking a bit tired lately, we look fresher than ever at the right end of the season.
    screaming in the family corner, scaring the kiddies

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Wee Waa Womble View Post
    4 points clear of Catalan now. Depending on wires results we could go 2nd next week.
    On last night's displays I'd certainly back you to go third!

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    Dare I suggest this could be due to our terrible effort in the Challenge Cup this year? We've had weeks off while the other top 4 clubs have been involved in quarter finals and semi finals. We'll get another one while Hull and Wire go at it at Wembley. It could all play a part.
    Consistency has played a big part as well IMO. We've had a settled team out for a good few weeks and you can see an understanding and a trust developing. That plays a big part defensively, knowing what the guy inside and outside of you is going to do and reacting from that. Also means that you can set out roles for players that they can build into, if everyone knows their role in the team and has time to work at it you'll see an understanding and an improvement and that's helped us win 7 games on the bounce ultimately.

    I've said it a few times but having key players fit and available has helped us as well. We're playing with more width at the minute because we have players outwide to work that well. Lomax, Swift and Percival are key to our attack and we've been without them for large periods of this season. The guys who filled in for them carried nowhere near the same threat because they lack that raw pace. We wouldn't have scored some of the tries we scored last night earlier in the year due to the lack of quality on the edges. Very difficult to play with width when you have no speed outwide and that's why we've spent so much of the year playing through the pack. Now they are back we are moving the ball and are much more of a threat. Hopefully Percival is OK because he's absolutely pivotal to our attack.

    Last night was impressive. Some good tries in there and the class of Percival told in that first half. Two beautiful breaks to set up a couple of tries.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephen07 View Post
    Dare I suggest this could be due to our terrible effort in the Challenge Cup this year? We've had weeks off while the other top 4 clubs have been involved in quarter finals and semi finals. We'll get another one while Hull and Wire go at it at Wembley. It could all play a part.
    I think the 4 weeks we had off from midway through May to midway through June may have kept us fresh for the business end of the season.
    Forwards win games. The backs decide by how much.

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