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Thread: Cunningham response to critics

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Chief View Post
    Did he really say that?
    Don't Saints have a Media Officer,if they do he/she should be sacked letting Cunningham make such a fool of himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Chief View Post
    Did he really say that?
    The David Brent School of Management

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    KC's problem, is that he is just a chilled out entertainer.

    FACT.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saint Margaret View Post
    Don't Saints have a Media Officer,if they do he/she should be sacked letting Cunningham make such a fool of himself.
    Nail on head! If you didn't know any better, it's almost as if someone's letting KC hang himself out to dry on purpose, and it's been going on for weeks.

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    SAINTS face a tough trip to Catalans this Saturday in a game that is vital for their top four hopes.

    A win at the Stade Gilbert Brutus would keep them in touch as the regular season enters its crunch point.

    But as Keiron Cunningham explains, they will need to be more clinical if they have designs on the two points.

    "I thought the effort and enthusiasm in a lot of areas were good against Warrington Bullsh*t - we were dreadful.
    "We were missing a half which hurt us, but we will get better. You've just loaned one out to Leigh
    "Warrington had five chances in the game and took them. Five chances? Really?
    "It looks like a convincing victory but people don't see how hard the players are working. That's because it was a convincing victory, no matter how hard the players are working.
    "There are positives in our game at the moment, Where?
    "The signs are good as a group, How?
    "They are a good group and are working hard on and off the field but we need that complete package. When we do we will be a good side. When is that then? Why are we not a complete package this season?
    "Everyone is looking at signings at the moment. You have to hold your nerve a little bit and not panic buy especially in a salary capped sport. We have done that in the past and ended up with players for two or three years that haven't worked out. Comedy gold right there.
    "We have to be smart about how we do our shopping as the next recruits are the ones that will take us to the promised land. Signing Jack Owens is the opposite of smart.
    "People have to understand that behind the scenes me, Eamonn and Mike Rush are working tirelessly hard to get things right at this club. You mean sort this mess out that's been created...
    "I know where we need to head and what we need to do. Well your 'tactics' arent getting us there!
    We aren't generally far off that and I'm sure if things turn around, we start playing well and get a few recruits then those same people will pat me on the back.
    If things turn around... not when?

    Infuriates me every time he opens his gob. I'm sick of hearing all this 'we're not far off' bo**ocks. Not far off what? Competing with the top teams? Putting in a decent performance? Getting back to something like the Saints of old? Because if he thinks that then he is the most deluded man on the planet. There's only been one entertaining 80 minutes all season and that was when we beat Leeds. Apart from that its been utter crap and I can't see anything other than a tonking from Catalans on Saturday either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MancSaint View Post
    Nail on head! If you didn't know any better, it's almost as if someone's letting KC hang himself out to dry on purpose, and it's been going on for weeks.
    Speaking fluently to the media comes with the territory of being a succesful manager. The late Brian Clough didnt have any problems with them, in fact he was able to coeerce them into being a valuable asset. I would love to have seen what response a suggestion that he ought to have worked with a media officer would have drew.

    However KC's foolish ramblings are a symptom of being out of his depth. Even if he was the rugby league equivalent of Alistair Campbell you can only blag for so long. It stands to reason that coach's who are able can express themselves more adequately as they have a better understanding of what needs to be done, and crucially perhaps, how.

    By contrast KC sounds like someone who is almost bi polar at times: full of bombastic 'what i dont know isnt worth knowing, ' surly observations on the fans, over optimistic analysis of the game and then more phlegmatic, philosophical analysis of the 'group'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake920 View Post
    SAINTS face a tough trip to Catalans this Saturday in a game that is vital for their top four hopes.

    A win at the Stade Gilbert Brutus would keep them in touch as the regular season enters its crunch point.

    But as Keiron Cunningham explains, they will need to be more clinical if they have designs on the two points.

    "I thought the effort and enthusiasm in a lot of areas were good against Warrington Bullsh*t - we were dreadful.
    "We were missing a half which hurt us, but we will get better. You've just loaned one out to Leigh
    "Warrington had five chances in the game and took them. Five chances? Really?
    "It looks like a convincing victory but people don't see how hard the players are working. That's because it was a convincing victory, no matter how hard the players are working.
    "There are positives in our game at the moment, Where?
    "The signs are good as a group, How?
    "They are a good group and are working hard on and off the field but we need that complete package. When we do we will be a good side. When is that then? Why are we not a complete package this season?
    "Everyone is looking at signings at the moment. You have to hold your nerve a little bit and not panic buy especially in a salary capped sport. We have done that in the past and ended up with players for two or three years that haven't worked out. Comedy gold right there.
    "We have to be smart about how we do our shopping as the next recruits are the ones that will take us to the promised land. Signing Jack Owens is the opposite of smart.
    "People have to understand that behind the scenes me, Eamonn and Mike Rush are working tirelessly hard to get things right at this club. You mean sort this mess out that's been created...
    "I know where we need to head and what we need to do. Well your 'tactics' arent getting us there!
    We aren't generally far off that and I'm sure if things turn around, we start playing well and get a few recruits then those same people will pat me on the back.
    If things turn around... not when?

    Infuriates me every time he opens his gob. I'm sick of hearing all this 'we're not far off' bo**ocks. Not far off what? Competing with the top teams? Putting in a decent performance? Getting back to something like the Saints of old? Because if he thinks that then he is the most deluded man on the planet. There's only been one entertaining 80 minutes all season and that was when we beat Leeds. Apart from that its been utter crap and I can't see anything other than a tonking from Catalans on Saturday either.
    Do you fancy a job in Saints' media team ? We could do with some straight talking.

    Spot on, on all counts

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    You get limited opportunities to take advantage in big games. We were given lots of them but didn't post points.

    How does he manage to contradict himself in just two sentences?!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post
    You get limited opportunities to take advantage in big games. We were given lots of them but didn't post points.

    How does he manage to contradict himself in just two sentences?!
    I think he just means that against good teams you don't always spend a lot of time in good ball necessarily. Against Warrington though we spent a lot of time at points in the game, possibly more than you'd expect, on their line but didn't really look like breaking them down. On the flip side to that Warrington made the most of the field position they had and turned it into points. We've shown we are capable of scoring points in games but defensively we've been poor and are conceding too often. The difficult thing about Friday for me though was that we were poor in both areas and I guess the score backs that up.

    Spoke to one of the coaches at Warrington on Saturday. He admitted that they had the game won after 50 minutes or so had an eye on next week with players carrying knocks going into the game.
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    He is morphing into sports David Brent for all to see.
    Learned comment from The Don

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tez the Saint View Post
    I think he just means that against good teams you don't always spend a lot of time in good ball necessarily. Against Warrington though we spent a lot of time at points in the game, possibly more than you'd expect, on their line but didn't really look like breaking them down. On the flip side to that Warrington made the most of the field position they had and turned it into points. We've shown we are capable of scoring points in games but defensively we've been poor and are conceding too often. The difficult thing about Friday for me though was that we were poor in both areas and I guess the score backs that up.

    Spoke to one of the coaches at Warrington on Saturday. He admitted that they had the game won after 50 minutes or so had an eye on next week with players carrying knocks going into the game.
    That's interesting and backs up what I thought at the game. Even very early on the Wire fans were laughing at our pathetic efforts on their line though, I think they saw it won after about 7 minutes and were in party / relaxation mode from that point on

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    Was talking to a Saints player on Monday when I told him Tasi couldn't guide a peach he started laughing

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    Bruise a peach I mentioned to say

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gray77 View Post
    You get limited opportunities to take advantage in big games. We were given lots of them but didn't post points.

    How does he manage to contradict himself in just two sentences?!
    Not sure what you mean, but take your point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    Can anybody remember a coach from any sport who has slagged fans off for a sustained period like this?
    Good grief. Slagging us off? Really? Talk about selective/OTT interpretation. Why does nobody reproduce any positive comments about fans (there have been several over the last month or so).

    I think I'm going to have a break from this forum for a couple of weeks as it has snowballed into every thread closely resembling a pitchfork. I can't remember the last thing I read that actually resembled some form of support for anybody at all.

    That's not me saying KC will turn it around, but there has been a definite snowball effect on here of the type that accelerates at an alarming rate in these days of social media. No doubt I'll be cast as some sort of happy clapper but some people are losing the plot IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FearTheVee View Post
    Good grief. Slagging us off? Really? Talk about selective/OTT interpretation. Why does nobody reproduce any positive comments about fans (there have been several over the last month or so).

    I think I'm going to have a break from this forum for a couple of weeks as it has snowballed into every thread closely resembling a pitchfork. I can't remember the last thing I read that actually resembled some form of support for anybody at all.

    That's not me saying KC will turn it around, but there has been a definite snowball effect on here of the type that accelerates at an alarming rate in these days of social media. No doubt I'll be cast as some sort of happy clapper but some people are losing the plot IMO.
    I don't think he's intentionally slagging off the fans, but he comes across as a patronizing know-it-all. And obviously coaches know infinitely more than the fans, but the problem is that he doesn't present himself with any sort of tact, basically the attitude he conveys is "I know more than you so sit down and keep your mouths shut" despite the fact that on-field performances, recruitment, man-management and pretty much everything else have been dreadful and he clearly is way, way out of his depth as coach. Failure with humility would be fair enough but it's infuriating to see someone failing while maintaining a steadfast arrogance and refusing to acknowledge that anything is wrong, constantly trying to pull the wool over peoples eyes and effectively treating the fans like idiots as Cunningham is doing.

    And more than anything else he needs to understand that becoming more determined and resolute and "trying harder" isn't the answer. This isn't like when he was a player, when things were going badly and he could put his head down, drive for the line and get there if he was determined enough. I don't think Cunningham is intelligent enough to realise that coaching is totally different, and I don't think he will ever get it.

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    In a sense he is right. We did spend a lot of time in their 20, but couldn't score whereas they spent very little time in our 20 but scored nearly every time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drake920 View Post
    SAINTS face a tough trip to Catalans this Saturday in a game that is vital for their top four hopes.

    "Everyone is looking at signings at the moment. You have to hold your nerve a little bit and not panic buy especially in a salary capped sport. We have done that in the past and ended up with players for two or three years that haven't worked out. Comedy gold right there.
    "We have to be smart about how we do our shopping as the next recruits are the ones that will take us to the promised land. Signing Jack Owens is the opposite of smart.
    "People have to understand that behind the scenes me, Eamonn and Mike Rush are working tirelessly hard to get things right at this club. You mean sort this mess out that's been created...


    Wouldn't slate him for this. He's finally said publicly what we all know; recruitment has been a shambles, and said what his solution will be. I like it. Allow the crap to leave and be patient with replacing them. Wait for the right signings. Look at this season; if we'd waited we could have had Carney or Ferres. Instead, we're stuck with Tasi and Owens. I'm not saying those guys are on the same wages, but maybe we'd have been able to get one. Who knows what we paid to get Tasi away from Salford? I imagine too much given what the Salford lads are on. That Murdoch-Masila fella at Salford must have been available too. Imagine losing Tasi and then signing him, bet their fans are buzzing about it.

    People keep asking him to learn from his mistakes and that's pretty solid evidence of him starting to do so.

  19. #344
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    Ratchford's try started off on half way and is the type of try we could never score. Clarke makes the burst, swats off Walmsley, draws the full back and then pace takes Ratchford over.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddlyf View Post
    Wouldn't slate him for this. He's finally said publicly what we all know; recruitment has been a shambles, and said what his solution will be. I like it. Allow the crap to leave and be patient with replacing them. Wait for the right signings. Look at this season; if we'd waited we could have had Carney or Ferres. Instead, we're stuck with Tasi and Owens. I'm not saying those guys are on the same wages, but maybe we'd have been able to get one. Who knows what we paid to get Tasi away from Salford? I imagine too much given what the Salford lads are on. That Murdoch-Masila fella at Salford must have been available too. Imagine losing Tasi and then signing him, bet their fans are buzzing about it.

    People keep asking him to learn from his mistakes and that's pretty solid evidence of him starting to do so.
    Except he is a professional coach of a top team, and these are mistakes that even average fans could see coming from a mile off. It's alright blaming recruitment but he is the one doing the recruitment. Do we have to wait until we have an entire squad full of Middle 8/Championship standard players before KC 'learns' to recruit good players instead of below-average cast-offs from bottom half clubs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by 141 View Post
    Except he is a professional coach of a top team, and these are mistakes that even average fans could see coming from a mile off. It's alright blaming recruitment but he is the one doing the recruitment. Do we have to wait until we have an entire squad full of Middle 8/Championship standard players before KC 'learns' to recruit good players instead of below-average cast-offs from bottom half clubs?
    Well we already have so we don't have much choice on that front. I want him out but we're all criticising him for being in denial and the second he admits to something being wrong, we slate him for that too. What's he supposed to do/say?

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddlyf View Post
    Well we already have so we don't have much choice on that front. I want him out but we're all criticising him for being in denial and the second he admits to something being wrong, we slate him for that too. What's he supposed to do/say?
    Not get it so badly wrong in the first place. Ultimately there's nothing he can do or say that changes the fact that he has brought a bunch of substandard players into the club.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FearTheVee View Post
    Good grief. Slagging us off? Really? Talk about selective/OTT interpretation. Why does nobody reproduce any positive comments about fans (there have been several over the last month or so).

    I think I'm going to have a break from this forum for a couple of weeks as it has snowballed into every thread closely resembling a pitchfork. I can't remember the last thing I read that actually resembled some form of support for anybody at all.

    That's not me saying KC will turn it around, but there has been a definite snowball effect on here of the type that accelerates at an alarming rate in these days of social media. No doubt I'll be cast as some sort of happy clapper but some people are losing the plot IMO.
    Not sure you would get any other superleague coaches calling the paying supporters sheep. It is snowballing, because he makes it worse every time he opens his mouth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 141 View Post
    Not get it so badly wrong in the first place. Ultimately there's nothing he can do or say that changes the fact that he has brought a bunch of substandard players into the club.
    He could start by releasing all the rubbish/overpaid players he can this year. If he does that (big if really as I can't see the club letting LMS and Wilkin go) I'd be inclined to listen to him more on that front.

    He'd have to have an attacking tactical overhaul as well mind, and sort out the fringe defence. I love how he basically blamed Turner for it, dropped him and then we've seen no difference at all. He's clearly talking about Turner when he's on about being stuck with poor signings for multiple years. Turner was a young centre with genuine pace who started well at Saints. The truth is that he might not be perfect defensively, but he's definitely not the worst lad we've got out there and he spent most of his time trying to cover for Walsh's failings which KC then decided were his. Fages can make errors, Walsh actively avoids tackling people at times (I say at times, it was most of the time but in recent weeks he seems to have got marginally better) and Vea is a complete joke. Even lads like Thompson and Greenwood have missed multiple one on ones this season. So now Turner has been switched from a centre to a loose forward/stand off despite having a decent couple of seasons for Saints in his natural position and he's clearly off at the end of the season. Completely ruined a good player.

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    Quote Originally Posted by teddlyf View Post
    Well we already have so we don't have much choice on that front. I want him out but we're all criticising him for being in denial and the second he admits to something being wrong, we slate him for that too. What's he supposed to do/say?
    I concur, damned if he doesn't, damned if he does! It seems that it's all spiralled out of control a little and now he's struggling to contain the situation whilst we, the fans, are picking up on every utterance, myself included.

    Perhaps, a lighter touch, media wise might take him out of the firing line for a bit and give him time for some reflection.

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