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Thread: 2005 team

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    Default 2005 team

    just been watching the 2005 season highlights again (via season review DVDs) and even though we didn't win super league that year some of the play we did was outstanding. Watching the likes of Wellens, Cunningham, Lyon, fozzard, Albert and long in the same team was fantastic. The question for me is how do you think the team ten years ago would have performed if it played today?

    P.s. Do they still do the season reviews?
    Red vee

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    Quote Originally Posted by matty saint View Post
    just been watching the 2005 season highlights again (via season review DVDs) and even though we didn't win super league that year some of the play we did was outstanding. Watching the likes of Wellens, Cunningham, Lyon, fozzard, Albert and long in the same team was fantastic. The question for me is how do you think the team ten years ago would have performed if it played today?

    P.s. Do they still do the season reviews?
    Simple answer to that - it would wipe the floor with everyone.

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    They stopped Season Reviews in the last season at Knowsley Road - which still annoys me till this day. Not to have a record of the final season at KR was stupidity in the extreme, even if it was for one last year. Grrrr!

    Whilst times change and modern teams will always be ahead of contemporary teams in fitness levels, that team was miles ahead of this current one in almost every single position. Yet this team we have now are the Champions. It's a strange world.

    You'd struggle to name one of today's team that would get into the 2005 team.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DD View Post
    They stopped Season Reviews in the last season at Knowsley Road - which still annoys me till this day. Not to have a record of the final season at KR was stupidity in the extreme, even if it was for one last year. Grrrr!

    Whilst times change and modern teams will always be ahead of contemporary teams in fitness levels, that team was miles ahead of this current one in almost every single position. Yet this team we have now are the Champions. It's a strange world.

    You'd struggle to name one of today's team that would get into the 2005 team.
    Roby & Wilkin both made it into the 2005 team...also seem to remember Hardman getting a few games on wing that season (playoff game v Leeds sticks in my memory) & would have Tommy there instead of him, Tommy & Albert on wings would have been awesome imo.

    Other than that I'm struggling as I think even our best players at the moment would struggle with the quality we had then. Walsh would be classy enough but wouldnt have him above Long, and Walmsley may have got close but again had far better competition in the likes of Fozz, Baloo, Jammer, Maurie & Edmondson (who was brilliant at that time) than we have today.

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    Starting A Programme Collection greggo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wakey_saint View Post
    Roby & Wilkin both made it into the 2005 team...also seem to remember Hardman getting a few games on wing that season (playoff game v Leeds sticks in my memory) & would have Tommy there instead of him, Tommy & Albert on wings would have been awesome imo.

    Other than that I'm struggling as I think even our best players at the moment would struggle with the quality we had then. Walsh would be classy enough but wouldnt have him above Long, and Walmsley may have got close but again had far better competition in the likes of Fozz, Baloo, Jammer, Maurie & Edmondson (who was brilliant at that time) than we have today.
    On a week to week basis 2005 in my view would have thought how easy is this.there are still a few players with intensity and attitude who I hope will come good but as in football I feel sport is going a little bit soft and players are forgetting what they get paid for doing .l, m not to sure if it, s to do with health and safety issues if it is I would recommened don, t go the pitch and make a living in pc rant over

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    Quote Originally Posted by wakey_saint View Post
    Roby & Wilkin both made it into the 2005 team...also seem to remember Hardman getting a few games on wing that season (playoff game v Leeds sticks in my memory) & would have Tommy there instead of him, Tommy & Albert on wings would have been awesome imo.

    Other than that I'm struggling as I think even our best players at the moment would struggle with the quality we had then. Walsh would be classy enough but wouldnt have him above Long, and Walmsley may have got close but again had far better competition in the likes of Fozz, Baloo, Jammer, Maurie & Edmondson (who was brilliant at that time) than we have today.
    Hardman wasn't first choice so it's not an accurate comparison. If you're going to compare Hardman then it has to be against Dawson who is our current equivalent.

    We have been exceptionally lucky to see teams like that one. Players like Wellens, Lyon, Long, Sculthorpe and Cunningham don't come along very often and to have them all at the same time was a joy. Then add Albert Talau, Fozzard, Anderson, Hooper and it would walk over any team currently playing

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    Hardman wasn't first choice so it's not an accurate comparison. If you're going to compare Hardman then it has to be against Dawson who is our current equivalent.

    We have been exceptionally lucky to see teams like that one. Players like Wellens, Lyon, Long, Sculthorpe and Cunningham don't come along very often and to have them all at the same time was a joy. Then add Albert Talau, Fozzard, Anderson, Hooper and it would walk over any team currently playing
    I love these melancholy assessments that come along and
    compare us so unfavourably to the past after a couple of bad days at the office!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lion Saint View Post
    I love these melancholy assessments that come along and
    compare us so unfavourably to the past after a couple of bad days at the office!
    Would you like to show me one? I haven't assessed anyone or anything but please feel free to carry on pretending I have



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    Quote Originally Posted by wakey_saint View Post
    Roby & Wilkin both made it into the 2005 team...also seem to remember Hardman getting a few games on wing that season (playoff game v Leeds sticks in my memory) & would have Tommy there instead of him, Tommy & Albert on wings would have been awesome imo.

    Other than that I'm struggling as I think even our best players at the moment would struggle with the quality we had then. Walsh would be classy enough but wouldnt have him above Long, and Walmsley may have got close but again had far better competition in the likes of Fozz, Baloo, Jammer, Maurie & Edmondson (who was brilliant at that time) than we have today.
    Even Roby was understudy to Cunningham. Man for man though it's difficult to see anyone from the current team getting in the 2005 or more still the 2006 side. Maybe Walmesley or Amor would get a place on the bench?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    Hardman wasn't first choice so it's not an accurate comparison. If you're going to compare Hardman then it has to be against Dawson who is our current equivalent.

    We have been exceptionally lucky to see teams like that one. Players like Wellens, Lyon, Long, Sculthorpe and Cunningham don't come along very often and to have them all at the same time was a joy. Then add Albert Talau, Fozzard, Anderson, Hooper and it would walk over any team currently playing
    Can't put a price on nostalgia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buddy View Post
    Would you like to show me one? I haven't assessed anyone or anything but please feel free to carry on pretending I have



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Which part of "melancholy assessment" do you not understand given that you said "we have been exceptionally lucky...it would walk over any team currently playing."? Two pensive, thoughtful assessments as far as I can see.

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    Default 2005 team

    Quote Originally Posted by Tabasco View Post
    Which part of "melancholy assessment" do you not understand given that you said "we have been exceptionally lucky...it would walk over any team currently playing."? Two pensive, thoughtful assessments as far as I can see.
    I understand quite clearly.

    In his little dig about bad days at the office he's suggesting I'm saying something I am not.






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    Quote Originally Posted by greggo View Post
    On a week to week basis 2005 in my view would have thought how easy is this.there are still a few players with intensity and attitude who I hope will come good but as in football I feel sport is going a little bit soft and players are forgetting what they get paid for doing .l, m not to sure if it, s to do with health and safety issues if it is I would recommened don, t go the pitch and make a living in pc rant over
    For you sir

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lion Saint View Post
    I love these melancholy assessments that come along and
    compare us so unfavourably to the past after a couple of bad days at the office!
    I dont think buddy has done that at all. Forgetting the bad days, and even taking our current best days which players from today would get into the 05, 06 or 00/01 starting 13 (or 17 if you wish) side ahead of what was present then. We are not talking outliers in the squad, genuine starting players from those years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyl View Post
    I dont think buddy has done that at all. Forgetting the bad days, and even taking our current best days which players from today would get into the 05, 06 or 00/01 starting 13 (or 17 if you wish) side ahead of what was present then. We are not talking outliers in the squad, genuine starting players from those years?
    None! :-)

    It's basically a symptom of what the coaches have done to the players.

    In years gone by, the biggest emphasis was teaching and harvesting skills. Now we are gradually seeing the replacement of all that with seventeen almost identikit players who run at brick walls and tackle all day long.

    Few players stand out as being anything special anymore. There are no real stars emerging, bar Burgess and Tomkins. The others that are trumped as being stars simply are when compared to your Johnny-average robots who nobody would recognise if they fell over.
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    The is only 1 player who I think would make the 13, Makinson instead of Gardner

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    2005 was IMO a more enjoyable season week-by-week than 2006. We played better rugby, were more exciting and it was just more fun watching the team. It had a great balance because it was Millward's team but ended up being coached for half the season by Anderson. In the few seasons prior to it we'd underachieved and maybe been too blasé, and in the seasons after it under DA we became a bit more route-one despite the obvious trophies.

    So, the 05 season ended up being the end of one thing and the beginning of another, but I always rated that team as one of the best I'd seen despite the lack of silverware. Jamie Lyon was more impressive IMO in 05 than in 06, we played better stuff, we had the 75-0, we had the (original) last-gasp Long DG against Wire at KR, we had the mad comeback against them at the HJ, it just has loads of week-to-week memories that 06 really lacked aside from the big Finals.

    It was a team and a season that deserved a lot more at the end of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaintJon View Post
    The is only 1 player who I think would make the 13, Makinson instead of Gardner
    I think Walmsley & Walsh would have a shot of getting in over Fozzard and Hooper personally, but that 2005 / 2006 team was classy especially in the backs. Cayless was different gravy though, not sure Walmsley would get in above him based on his 2006 season.
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    Personally, I'd be taking Amor and Walmsley over Edmondson all day, every day. I'd also take Greenwood, LMS and Vea over Bennett. Probably an argument for Makinson over Gardner as well. Hooper at 6 over Burns or Walsh ? Not convinced by that either.

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    The 2005 team was great but, like most of Millward's sides, it did lack depth (particularly in the forwards) and also didn't have a proper stand off. Once you got past the first choice pack there were a lot of middling-to-rubbish prop-come-second-rowers who would struggle to make our current side (Edmo, Mason, Bennett, Bibey etc.). Also, players who went on to be excellent were still a bit green at that point (e.g. Graham, Maurie). Like others I'd pick Makinson ahead of Gardner. I'd pick Walsh as Long's HB partner ahead of Hooper (who was a really handy 13 but not so great a 6). I think there's an argument for picking Amor ahead of Fozzard, who had his on and his off days, and Walmsley is streets ahead of the highest standard Edmo ever reached (much as I liked him). One of our current back rowers would probably make it into the 17, too.

    1. Wellens
    2. Albert
    3. Lyon
    4. Talau
    5. Makinson
    6. Long
    7. Walsh
    8. Amor/Fozzard
    9. Cunningham
    10. Walmsley
    11. Gilmour
    12. Anderson, V./Vea/Greenwood
    13. Sculthorpe

    14. Roby
    15. Anderson, P.
    16. Fa'asavalu/LMS
    17. Hooper
    Last edited by Dux; 24th April 2015 at 14:57.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dux View Post
    The 2005 team was great but, like most of Millward's sides, it did lack depth (particularly in the forwards) and also didn't have a proper stand off. Once you got past the first choice pack there were a lot of middling-to-rubbish prop-come-second-rowers who would struggle to make our current side (Edmo, Mason, Bennett, Bibey etc.). Also, players who went on to be excellent were still a bit green at that point (e.g. Graham, Maurie). Like others I'd pick Makinson ahead of Gardner. I'd pick Walsh as Long's HB partner ahead of Hooper (who was a really handy 13 but not so great a 6). I think there's an argument for picking Amor ahead of Fozzard, who had his on and his off days, and Walmsley is streets ahead of the highest standard Edmo ever reached (much as I liked him). One of our current back rowers would probably make it into the 17, too.

    1. Wellens
    2. Albert
    3. Lyon
    4. Talau
    5. Makinson
    6. Long
    7. Walsh
    8. Amor/Fozzard
    9. Cunningham
    10. Walmsley
    11. Gilmour
    12. Anderson, V./Vea/Greenwood
    13. Sculthorpe

    14. Roby
    15. Anderson, P.
    16. Fa'asavalu/LMS
    17. Hooper
    That looks a very tasty side. I loved Fizzy so would have him in front of Amor. Shame Chris Joynt had just retired. Add him to the 2nd Row and what a team that would be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SS View Post
    Personally, I'd be taking Amor and Walmsley over Edmondson all day, every day. I'd also take Greenwood, LMS and Vea over Bennett. Probably an argument for Makinson over Gardner as well. Hooper at 6 over Burns or Walsh ? Not convinced by that either.
    Walmsley over Edmondson certainly, but the two first choice props in 2005 were Anderson and Fozzard with Fa'asavalu and Graham benching. Edmondson wasn't necessarily first choice. Comparing our best now to the 17th or 18th best in a team then is a little unfair.

    I'd agree on Vea over Bennett certainly.

    Hooper was a stand off so a comparison to the scrum half is for argument's sake only. It's not relevant. I'd take Hooper over Burns any day. I haven't seen Burns do anything for us yet.

    Makinson over Gardner, maybe, but you are comparing right wing to our left of then. Is that fair? If we are comparing 2 against 2 and 5 against 5, Albert beats Makinson and Gardner beats Swift every day of the week.

    If we do things as we should for these exercises by comparing right wing to right wing, stand off to stand off and prop to prop, rather than shoe horning them in to suit a flawed argument, we'd find that only Mike Bennett and maybe Nick Fozzard's place would be under threat in the starting thirteen.
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    I have never watched anything from 2005 but I did watch a couple of games from 2006 and those were the best and most entertaining stuff I've watched in terms of rugby league.

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    Quote Originally Posted by matty saint View Post
    just been watching the 2005 season highlights again (via season review DVDs) and even though we didn't win super league that year some of the play we did was outstanding. Watching the likes of Wellens, Cunningham, Lyon, fozzard, Albert and long in the same team was fantastic. The question for me is how do you think the team ten years ago would have performed if it played today?

    P.s. Do they still do the season reviews?
    I'd swap that squad for this one in a heartbeat. We'd be favourites for the double

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