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Blobbynator
22nd November 2007, 16:18
O'Neill is the bookies favourite, with Jose Mourinho not far behind. But, who would you pick?

The obvious contenders for me are those two along with Capello and Scolari. All four have experience in European football, have been big successes at the clubs they've been at and are not afraid to make tough calls (e.g. dropping out of form players).

Saint Bert
22nd November 2007, 16:33
Don't believe there is a need for a full time England manager.

The number of games played simply does not justify it.

Mr Turncoat
22nd November 2007, 16:43
Tony Smith.

Knight Shadow
22nd November 2007, 17:04
Don't believe there is a need for a full time England manager.

The number of games played simply does not justify it.


although i am not football inclined....the understanding is that football is the life blood of England like it or loath it that is the truth, i mean the number of GB/England games dose not call for reason for tony smiths job but he dose other rolls so one would take it that that is what the England manger dose also

Blobbynator
22nd November 2007, 17:06
Don't believe there is a need for a full time England manager.

The number of games played simply does not justify it.

Whether a full time manager is needed or not, a manager is needed hence the question.

Barbarian
22nd November 2007, 17:24
Sven Goran Erickson

Paul Cullen's Mantra
22nd November 2007, 17:44
WITHOUT A SHADOW OF DOUBT, IT HAS TO BE.......


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Terminator.jpg

Supersaint
22nd November 2007, 18:27
The Press

Doogal
22nd November 2007, 18:48
Chesty La Rue.

Paul Cullen's Mantra
22nd November 2007, 18:57
MCLAREN AND VENABLES LOOKING FOR A NEW JOB......


www.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0126029/sq600sc50f111.jpg.html?seq=2

Tallahassee
22nd November 2007, 19:39
It doesnt matter who takes over,the players are still big time charlies who are not arsed,the coach cant be totally blamed for this farce!:mad: GB RL for BBC Team of the year 2007!

ploughman
22nd November 2007, 20:07
o neill has done well in the couldron of glasgow,so he can certainly handle the pressure.but for my money it has to be mourinho.he will command the respect of the players,he doesn't give a toss about the press and is good value at the press conferences!
as for full time or not,i am sure that if every other national team has a full time manager,i'm sure england should have one.the england rl team have a full time coach and they play less than the football boys.
after the shambolic attempt at trying to play football last night the fa need to get this appointment 100% right
as lawrence dallaliglio said on top gear
"the andrex football premiership,soft and unneccasarilly expensive"

Blobbynator
22nd November 2007, 20:12
Mourinho has apparently ruled himself out of the job this evening. The list gets shorter...

THELAST3YARDS
22nd November 2007, 20:56
I think it should be an Englishman, Redknapp or Coppell perhaps.

As both of those are long shots then I can see a foreign coach being appointed. That being the case I would go for Fabio Capello if at all possible.

daves
22nd November 2007, 20:59
Even the Lord God Almighty(which ever God that may be)would have his work cut out to coach that bunch of overpaid,egotistical prima-donnas.The only reason I can see for taking the job would be that,if and when you fail miserably,you will have earned a tidy sum and when you are "sacked" you will get a nice pay-off.
Personally,I think a good place to start would be to sack all the "suits" who attended the press conference today and then look at the manager.

Blobbynator
22nd November 2007, 21:48
I think it should be an Englishman

None of them are good enough. It has to be the best man for the job for me.

The Greatest
22nd November 2007, 21:59
I think it should be an Englishman,

I love quotes like this. Go on, explain why it should be an Englishman.

ST Maca
22nd November 2007, 22:12
Give it Shearer least we will see some passion, The Germans, Dutch and Brazilians have gone that way and are making the latter stages of big tournaments.

pricey73
22nd November 2007, 22:13
so that he can get slated in the press and blame his lack of european knowledge for the failings of a bunch of big time charlies

The Greatest
22nd November 2007, 22:25
Give it Shearer least we will see some passion, .

And that is my second favourite quote. Come on!!! Give it some passion. Sod tactics. Sod technique and sod managerial experience as long as we huff and puff and clench our fists we'll be fine.

As for Shearer, no ta. He's a dirty and sly little cretin that has turned Newcastle supporters and the dressing room against more than one manager.


No The Germans, Dutch and Brazilians have gone that way and are making the latter stages of big tournaments.

Thats because they are technically superior sides with a winning mentality. Players in Holland and Brazil in particular are brought up on playing technically great football whereas we huff and puff and run around like headless chickens. Our league is only good because its where the most of the big money is so we can import great foreigners. Most of our home grown players are vastly over rated.

THELAST3YARDS
22nd November 2007, 22:25
I love quotes like this. Go on, explain why it should be an Englishman.

Read the threads re Maurie and Tony Smith.

Capello on names linked so far.

The Greatest
22nd November 2007, 22:28
Read the threads re Maurie and Tony Smith.

Capello on names linked so far.

So it shouldnt be the best man for the job then. How silly. We want a manager that gives us the best chance of winning; if that man is foreign then he's foreign. If he's English then he's English. It doesnt matter.

THELAST3YARDS
22nd November 2007, 22:35
So it shouldnt be the best man for the job then. How silly. We want a manager that gives us the best chance of winning; if that man is foreign then he's foreign. If he's English then he's English. It doesnt matter.

Call me crazy but I (and I may well be on my own here) think International competition should be just that.

Inter - National....between nations.

England pick all their squad, manager, coaches et al from their own nation.

The French / Italians etc all do the same.

Seems simple to me.

The Greatest
22nd November 2007, 22:52
The French / Italians etc all do the same.

Seems simple to me.

Do they.

A large number of the French side are Africans who have chosen their nationality as French. Still, your right. They only pick from their own country. They never take Senagalese players like Viera or players from Zaire like Makalele or south americans like Malouda.

THELAST3YARDS
22nd November 2007, 22:57
Do they.

A large number of the French side are Africans who have chosen their nationality as French. Still, your right. They only pick from their own country. They never take Senagalese players like Viera or players from Zaire like Makalele or south americans like Malouda.

I worded that poorly. Although it reads worse when you remove what was around it.

I should have stated that the French, Italians etc should do the same as I think England should. I.E everyone involved in an international organisation should be from the country they represent.

The rules allow foreign coaches so I would get Capello.

The Greatest
22nd November 2007, 23:13
I worded that poorly. Although it reads worse when you remove what was around it.
.


I know, thats why I did it lol


I should have stated that the French, Italians etc should do the same as I think England should. I.E everyone involved in an international organisation should be from the country they represent.

The rules allow foreign coaches so I would get Capello.

I agree with you on the players, thats definately right. On managers though I dont see the big deal. I personally want a foreign manager because I dont see any suitable British candidates. I dont buy the Martin O'Neil myth, he's ok at best. I dont buy the "big Sam Alardyce" myth, he isnt a proven winner. IMO you want people like Scholari (not going to happen), Mourhinio, Capello etc...

THELAST3YARDS
22nd November 2007, 23:17
I know, thats why I did it lol



I agree with you on the players, thats definately right. On managers though I dont see the big deal. I personally want a foreign manager because I dont see any suitable British candidates. I dont buy the Martin O'Neil myth, he's ok at best. I dont buy the "big Sam Alardyce" myth, he isnt a proven winner. IMO you want people like Scholari (not going to happen), Mourhinio, Capello etc...

:) I vote for Capello then.

Glenn
23rd November 2007, 08:01
lippi out of work also won world cup with italy last year when no one thought he had a chance top class manager

Shakespeare
23rd November 2007, 10:16
lippi out of work also won world cup with italy last year when no one thought he had a chance top class manager

He also had the italian players around him. Makes it easier.

DD
23rd November 2007, 10:43
I cut and pasted this from another thread on another site, I didn't write it purposely for the benefit of you half a dozen before anyone says owt! lol

It isn't about the manager as such. It's about where English football goes from here.

-----------

There seems to be a lot of people calling for the English clubs to be limited as to the amount of foreign players they can have, and I accept the point, but there are too many people that seem to think that the lack of English players at the top clubs is a cause of the problem when, in reality, it’s a symptom of the problem.

The fact that the three players who ended up as the front three at the end of last night’s game are all reserve players speaks volumes. The English pool of talent simply isn’t good enough for the top clubs to justify buying them.

Football clubs have to prosper to survive and clubs have ambitions of winning trophies. The big four in this country cannot compete with the bigger clubs in Europe on the Champions League stage, as things stand at present, if they are forced into fielding substandard players, just because they are English. The chasing pack in the Premiership cannot ever hope to catch the big four if they have similar restrictions imposed upon them.

The long term answer is to cut the foreign players down (although can this legally be done given the freedom of movement within the European Union?) but at the moment it is simply not practical unless the big boys are prepared to forfeit their chances of being serious players on the European stage, and I’m pretty sure they are not.

We have to put into action a ten year plan. England will not become successful overnight. Every time England play against some remotely decent opposition from the continent, it is very apparent to all who watch that they are streets ahead of us in terms of technical ability.

Why is it that countries who lack the finances and facilities of England, continuously produce more technically gifted players?

For me, you have to look at the coaching of the kids. This country has, for too long, kidded itself that lung bursting stamina and fitness, the ability to cover every blade of grass and be able to ‘get stuck in’ is the recipe for success. This country does not produce players like Ronaldinho and Messi it produces the all action players such as Steven Gerrard who may be great at what they do but are very limited in terms of technical skills.

You look at Croatia last night, they were all confident on the ball. They can play the ball out of defence, use their speed of thought to make one touch passing movements. Their passes go to their own man and they have great footballing skills. All these attributes are seen as basic abilities in a footballer in the more successful countries, yet we can’t do any of them. Here, you hear of many a coach who rarely coaches football skills, their primary concern is running, weights exercises etc. There is far too little work spent on teaching the youngsters how to play with the football and hence you have an international team that has it’s supposed best midfielder repeatedly unable to find a team mate with the most basic of passes.

It will take years, but unless this country’s footballing schools start emphasising their training on ball work and teach the kids proper footballing skills instead of getting them to concentrate on the old English style of quickening the pace of the game, harassing the opposition and seeing 100% effort and commitment as being more important than being technically skilful, then this country will continue to fall further behind the dozen or so European nations who can play us off the park at this moment in time.

saint cross
23rd November 2007, 14:14
Capello would be a great choice. Worked with some of the biggest clubs and players in europe and has a wealth of experience and is tactically very good. I would love to see a English manager but unfortunately none in my eyes come close to fitting the bill

Blobbynator
23rd November 2007, 15:37
Curbishley and Allardyce ruled themself out and now O'Neill rules himself out.

So that leaves Capello and er... Harry Redknapp. lol

AnonymousSaint
23rd November 2007, 17:39
I accept that martin O'Neill is a good manager, but in all seriousness doing well in Scotland isn't that hard the title is only ever contested by Rangers and Celtic.

I am yet to see him do anything major here in England.

We need Jose, he's the man for the job, as a much as I hate him, he's the best choice.

Barbarian
23rd November 2007, 18:07
Scot Carson

SaintJose
23rd November 2007, 18:56
Looks like Capello is the only realistic choice now. Allardyce or Curbishley would be like McClaren all over again

bozzy!
23rd November 2007, 22:00
i dont care who they appoint. on wednesday the starting team england put out earned in total 3,500,000 pound a week between them. i bet the croatians didnt even earn half that. England are simply not good enough and the sooner we realise that the better. Mark Lawrenson hit the nail on the head, apart from stevie g, we have no world class players. Before you say what about rooney, yeah he has the potential to be world class, but he isnt yet, can you mention him in the same breath as messi? No. but you can mention gerrard alongside Kaka.

Another reason i am glad england lost are because of the fickle fans. i actually feel sorry for the very very very very very few england fans out there. half time and they are booing the team off, when they get it back to 2-2 they are singing the national anthem, and singing to the croatians 'youre not singing anymore'. now in contrast, when liverpool were getting beat 3-0 in istanbul did the crowd boo? No. they sang youll never walk alone to get behind the lads, and low and behold it worked.

Also how can a manc sing to steven gerrard 'the baby's not yours....' and then when he is on england duty be up his arse and want him to do well? i could never in my wildest dreams cheer on the likes of wayne rooney and big nose neville.

so as soon as england wake up and realise they are not a big nation in world football the better, we are no better than northern ireland at this moment in time.

parrsaint
23rd November 2007, 22:00
The England job is definately the poisoned chalice. Its a wonder anyone wants it.

Paul Cullen's Mantra
23rd November 2007, 22:03
I'll have it gov...or perhaps you have to be a member of this sect to have a chance of getting the job?

www.clowns-international.co.uk/

pricey73
23rd November 2007, 22:08
agree with you bozzy don't support liverpool but the stick players get it's no wonder some seem to be better for there clubs

Shakespeare
23rd November 2007, 22:31
Curbishley and Allardyce ruled themself out and now O'Neill rules himself out.

So that leaves Capello and er... Harry Redknapp. lol

Dont laugh. Harry Redknapp is a superb manager.

The Greatest
23rd November 2007, 23:20
i dont care who they appoint. on wednesday the starting team england put out earned in total 3,500,000 pound a week between them. i bet the croatians didnt even earn half that. England are simply not good enough and the sooner we realise that the better. Mark Lawrenson hit the nail on the head, apart from stevie g, we have no world class players. Before you say what about rooney, yeah he has the potential to be world class, but he isnt yet, can you mention him in the same breath as messi? No. but you can mention gerrard alongside Kaka.

.

ah. What a coincidence. The only English world class player is from a team you support and (due to another amazing coincidence) a great player from your nearest rivals isnt.

Ive got some news for you fella. Gerrard is not world class, and no he cant be mentioned in the same breath as Messi or for that matter a whole host of other players. The guy is superb for Liverpool, a true great but has done the sum total of cock all on the international stage. Gerrard, ability wise, is vastly inferior to Messi, Ronaldhinio (even the recent $hit version), Deco, Kaka, Pierlo, Riquelme, Aimar, and previously Zidane, Nedved, Figo, Rivaldo. He is a long shot merchant with a lot of drive, effort and a reasonable amount of skill but nothing compared to those players above. If I could be @rsed, I could probably name more.
Gerrard epitomises what the Premiership is about and what is needed in the Premiership. Grit, determination, a will to win, passion, pride and blended in with some skill but nothing compared to truely great world players. This is why England dont perform at international level despite the huge expectation; it is because we over rate our players despite the fact that the aint that good. We dont acknowlege that they lack the technical ability that so many foreign players have. Gerrard is probably our best player based on Premiership form and yet he doesnt have that much skill in comparison.

ploughman
23rd November 2007, 23:51
a message to the greatest
thanks for posting that you have saved me a job
wednesday night showed that we have NO world class players.our best player was a reserve from liverpool!gerrard is not and never will be world class.as long as there is bias coming from supporters like bozzy,only a fool would take the england job.damned if he does,damned if he doesnt.

Shakespeare
23rd November 2007, 23:52
Again Chris, i have to disagree.

Skills are only a part of being a world class player. I can find a street kid with more skill than Deco. Stevie G has a World Class footballing game. He can control a game and has amazing foresight. He does possess skill and has performed well for his nation. If you say he has done cock all then im afraid that you have been watching these international games with your head, severely wedged up your arse.

The Greatest
24th November 2007, 00:01
Again Chris, i have to disagree.

Skills are only a part of being a world class player. I can find a street kid with more skill than Deco..

Deco has awesome touch, vision, control and range of passing though he doesnt get 'stuck in'


Stevie G has a World Class footballing game. He can control a game and has amazing foresight..


He has lots of qualities, which I named. I think in the premiership he is superb and suited to the game here. He is also helped by the fact he plays for a club he loves so you will almost always get 110% out of him.


He does possess skill..

I agree. Just not that much compared to truely world class players. I make no apology for comparing him to greats because that what you have to be compared to in order to make a claim for being world class. How does he stack up against Zidane? Nedved? Ronaldhinio? Kaka? He just isnt in the same class skill wise. He will out enthuse most if not all of these players but on technical ability is isnt even close and whats worse is Gerrard is one of our most skillfull players.



and has performed well for his nation...

It is widely accepted that he hasnt. He has performed nowhere near to his club level for England. He hasnt dragged England along. He hasnt dug us out of the $hit when we have needed it. He has barely dominated a game. Sure, you will be able to cherry pick a few good performances but thats about it.


If you say he has done cock all then im afraid that you have been watching these international games with your head, severely wedged up your arse.

Perhaps cock all was a bit harsh. He hasnt been great though. He has been average to half decent most of the time.

Shakespeare
24th November 2007, 00:54
I agree. Just not that much compared to truely world class players. I make no apology for comparing him to greats because that what you have to be compared to in order to make a claim for being world class. How does he stack up against Zidane? Nedved? Ronaldhinio? Kaka? He just isnt in the same class skill wise. He will out enthuse most if not all of these players but on technical ability is isnt even close and whats worse is Gerrard is one of our most skillfull players.

Football, as you are aware, is a team game. Steve possess qualities that some of your greats dont possess. He can mix it with the best of them and he has proven that on the European stage. Gerrard would compliment Zidane in that midfield as they offer different aspects of the game.

I would say that his international career has suffered due to a couple of things.

A. The lack of quality offered from others in recent times.

B. He cannot work with Frank Lampard. Theyre too similar a player but the chemistry between the two lacks.

The Greatest
24th November 2007, 01:44
Football, as you are aware, is a team game. Steve possess qualities that some of your greats dont possess. He can mix it with the best of them and he has proven that on the European stage..

While I agree we have changed this into a conversation about England and their failings. Their failings are that we are technically lacking, this is exemplified by Gerrard who is one of our most technically gifted players not being anywhere near as technically skillfull as his counterparts in many other foreign teams. On the other hand, our side is organised, determined and passionate. Again, Gerrard is a great example of this. Dont get me wrong, Gerrard is a top player, but skill wise he isnt in the worlds elite. This is why we struggle as the England side doesnt possess enough raw skill.


I would say that his international career has suffered due to a couple of things.

A. The lack of quality offered from others in recent times...

TBH I think thats bobbins. Gerrard has dragged poorly performing Liverpool sides kicking and screaming through games. In a poor side he is the one raising his game and making the difference. The England side should be ideal for him to do this in because there is barely anyone else doing it.


B. He cannot work with Frank Lampard. Theyre too similar a player but the chemistry between the two lacks.

aye. I agree with that. The manager must pick between one or the other and TBH it has to be Gerrard who pays. He can do what Lampard does plus more.

Reacher
24th November 2007, 11:56
Bozzy- You really do seem to think that Liverpool are the only club in England. How you can say Rooney is not world class is utter bollocks. Gerrard has done nothing for England and yet Rooney was the star of Euro 2004 until he broke his foot. He had been awesome up until then, all at the age of 19. He played in the 06 World Cup whilst not even fit. What has Gerrard done for England? Nothing.

And as a United fan I could not give a toss about England, so I agree with you on that score that I would not be cheering on any Scousers. Also a lot of Utd fans I know dont care about England either. Ten years ago I spent 2 years in London and saw how the locals perceived Northerners and in general the local press salivated over London based players. Utd players were getting booed at Wembley all because we were the best team in England.

The little Englander brigade were out in force with all the Stoke, Leeds, Shrewsbury fans etc all having their days out at Wembley with that being the highlight of their supporting careers. I also see at first hand some of the c**** that support England which just confirms how much i dont give a toss. I am so pleased that next year there will be no St George flags everywhere and xenophobic headlines in tabloid rags like the Sun. No supermarkets selling "Come on England t shirts". No females suddenly getting interested in football and drinking pints with their men. No steroid freaks beating their wives up because England get knocked out in the quarter final again. No hoodies rampaging through streets turning cars over because England are knocked out.

I am quite relieved and will sit back and enjoy watching the likes of Ronaldo skipping past defenders because he does possess the type of skill that the England players so sadly lack.

The Greatest
24th November 2007, 12:29
The little Englander brigade were out in force with all the Stoke, Leeds, Shrewsbury fans etc all having their days out at Wembley with that being the highlight of their supporting careers. I also see at first hand some of the c**** that support England which just confirms how much i dont give a toss. I am so pleased that next year there will be no St George flags everywhere and xenophobic headlines in tabloid rags like the Sun. No supermarkets selling "Come on England t shirts". No females suddenly getting interested in football and drinking pints with their men. No steroid freaks beating their wives up because England get knocked out in the quarter final again. No hoodies rampaging through streets turning cars over because England are knocked out.
.

You forgot the "no more blaming everyone else for us being knocked out in the quarters". Isnt it funny how we are always apparently robbed. We never just lose.

Blobbynator
24th November 2007, 21:47
Again Chris, i have to disagree.

Skills are only a part of being a world class player. I can find a street kid with more skill than Deco. Stevie G has a World Class footballing game. He can control a game and has amazing foresight. He does possess skill and has performed well for his nation. If you say he has done cock all then im afraid that you have been watching these international games with your head, severely wedged up your arse.

Gerrard has underperformed for England, no doubts about it.

Shakespeare
24th November 2007, 22:39
Gerrard has underperformed for England, no doubts about it.

Sold!

FFS Blobbs. At least expand you opinion.

Blobbynator
24th November 2007, 22:58
He's been the driving force behind the Liverpool team both domestically and in Europe. Just look at his performances in Europe when Liverpool won the Champions League. He got them through against Olympiakos and then of course got them back in it against Milan in the Final. He has never played anywhere near that level for England against a decent opposition. I honestly can't think of one great performance Internationally from Gerrard. He's done OK at times and at times he's been awful (like Wednesday). It's very frustrating when you see him deliver a great performance just a few days later. Lampard is the same, except he's probably been worse for England.

The Greatest
24th November 2007, 23:21
He got them through against Olympiakos and then of course got them back in it against Milan in the Final. .

Aye, and while we are on that subject I'd like to remind shakey of the footballing lesson that Gerrard and Liverpool received in the first half from Kaka and Pirlo. Granted, Liverpool won and fully deserved the win for the sheer determination but the first half was a feast of sensational football from those 2 players.

Shakespeare
24th November 2007, 23:39
Aye, and while we are on that subject I'd like to remind shakey of the footballing lesson that Gerrard and Liverpool received in the first half from Kaka and Pirlo. Granted, Liverpool won and fully deserved the win for the sheer determination but the first half was a feast of sensational football from those 2 players.

Get away. They didnt turn up in that first half. That is also just one half.

Through a team performance and a World Class leader's performance, Liverpool got back into that game and won it on penalties.

The players play for their club week and week out. You cant expect them to play at the same level with people they see for a few weeks a year.

The Greatest
25th November 2007, 00:15
Get away. They didnt turn up in that first half. That is also just one half.

Through a team performance and a World Class leader's performance, Liverpool got back into that game and won it on penalties..

Total rubbish. Liverpool and Gerrard had no answer in the first half. They conceeded 3 goals, let another in that was dissallowed and Milan went close another few times. This balance was only broken when Benitez made what appeared to be a strange tactical move by bringing on Hamman, he is the person who changed the game because he broke the Kaka / Pirlo link that was literally running riot. Liverpool did well to come back but their goals were a header, a penalty and a decent shot from the edge of the box. Milans football in the first half was carving Liverpool apart at will. It reminded me of when Valencia did it a few years earlier.....chasing shadows and all that.



The players play for their club week and week out. You cant expect them to play at the same level with people they see for a few weeks a year.

Same for all other international teams but their players dont under perform like our's do.