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Tourismwork
1st November 2007, 23:26
Which coach over the last 20 years has had the most effect on the Saints team? McClennan, Murphy, Millward, Anderson, Hanley, Hughes or McRae. Each has brought something to the team but which did the most for the Saints?

Whichever you pick, make sure you back it up with a reason why.

saints4ever
1st November 2007, 23:31
I reckon Mcrae, hes the one that has built the current sqaud today, he put the foundations in at the start of SL in on and off the field, didnt we win SL and one or two challange cups under him aswell, hes a top quality coach and im sure he will build salford back up.

saint billy
1st November 2007, 23:59
I reckon Mcrae, hes the one that has built the current sqaud today, he put the foundations in at the start of SL in on and off the field, didnt we win SL and one or two challange cups under him aswell, hes a top quality coach and im sure he will build salford back up.

Correct, IMO.

McRae set the ball rolling at Saints and i honestly thing, if he hadn't have had the impact he did we may well have not been as dominant have we have been.

Steward Saint
2nd November 2007, 00:26
Definitely McRae no doubt about it he laid the foundations for the team we have today and got us alot of silverware as well. Quite a successful coach and much loved by all Saints fans.

Llay Saint
2nd November 2007, 00:28
McRae for me to, built up a solid squad. Millward would never have had the results he did without the work done by McRae.

RedVee Admin
2nd November 2007, 01:28
McLennan.

Took a bunch of bricklayers, plasterers and electricians and made them equal to (bar points difference) a club full of professional players.

bazzo
2nd November 2007, 08:16
MCRAE started it all, MILLWARD almost ruined it all, and ANDERSON continued with the winning formula, may the new coach be has good as them!

R P McMurphy
2nd November 2007, 09:41
McLennan.

Took a bunch of bricklayers, plasterers and electricians and made them equal to (bar points difference) a club full of professional players.

Spot on!

Hamstersaint
2nd November 2007, 09:44
It has to be McRae, however to say Millward almost ruined it is harsh, as he continued the success that McRae and Ellery started. Millward was removed at the right time.
The new coach whoever that may be has alot to live up to!!!

bazzo
2nd November 2007, 09:58
It has to be McRae, however to say Millward almost ruined it is harsh, as he continued the success that McRae and Ellery started. Millward was removed at the right time.
The new coach whoever that may be has alot to live up to!!!

Millwards morals and behavior cost our club a lot of prestige ! and while he did maintain winning ways, The coach is also the clubs main representative and figure head , unfortunately Millward was Sh*t at this aspect of the job which for me puts him outside the great coach category we are debating

SaintsDavid
2nd November 2007, 09:59
You have to say Anderson just because he has had more success in a shorter space of time.

RedVee Admin
2nd November 2007, 10:13
McRae, McRae, McRae...

PAH!

Despite winning cups, he took charge of a side that had already been built. All he had to do was guide it and to be frank, his record post-Saints isn't as glowing as it should be for such a wonder coach.



The question was: Which coach over the last 20 years has had the most effect on the Saints team?

McRae didn't have an earth shattering effect, he didn't change much, he just fine tuned what was already in place, then watched it slip away.

To answer the question properly, you need to look deeper into the club and the squad at the time, look at key signings, look at key departures, look at performances and attitude before and after; not just look at the silverware won.

The men who I believe definitely had the most effect on the club in the last 20 years are McLennan and Hanley, followed by Anderson.

peter soutos tash
2nd November 2007, 10:38
mike mclennan gave saints the belief for the first time in years that we could actually beat wigan and the rest as they say is history......

Scouse Don
2nd November 2007, 10:47
Some interesting points.Think McRae is a clear leader here and I for one would think he has been considered for a return (just imo)...........
I am curious about the comments about Millward.I don't live in the town anymore so did'nt pick up the gossip at the time..can anyone enlighten me as to what went on...you can send me a private message if you like.

For short term impact Hanley..but for long term planning etc I would think McRae did change the club significantly more than any other coach.DA has had a different kind of effect imo he has dramatically improved defensive capabilities and we seem to be much more solid but possibly lack a little flair..but no complaints.I dont have my heart in my mouth as much as I used to.

Barbarian
2nd November 2007, 11:19
Millward certainly gave us the most exciting years we are likely to see as Saints fans with regards to attacking flair, last minute comebacks and complete unpredictability.

alf wayliner
2nd November 2007, 11:38
IMHO McRae was one of the poorest coaches of the last 20 years. I recall some of the shite we played in 97/98 and we were bad.

In 1998 we were on the slide after McRae's period and Hanley came in and gave the team some steel and a professional outlook. If you look at the team that was so inept in 98 and then the one that finished champions in 99, 13 of the 17 on duty in the GF were under McRae the previous season, and don't give me any gubbins about him not getting a contract and that he wasn't motivated because of that in 98, he's supposed to be the consumate pro and get on with the job to the best of his ability.

I believe that if we hadn't brought in Hanley there would have been no success like we've had for the last 8 years. He brought an attitude to the club that hasn't been there before, I really rate Mike McClennan and his time in charge stands up for itself, he was a remarkable coach who did a good job at turning a sows ear in to something resembling a silk purse but he didn't have that professional attitude that Hanley brought with him. The determination to win, the steel of a defensive side of Saints that I hadn't seen in evidence so many times in one season ever before then, and I'd been watching them for nearly 30 years in 99.

McClennan left some good memories, Hanley left a legacy!

Scouse Don
2nd November 2007, 12:10
Are you saying Mcrae won nowt ?

RedVee Admin
2nd November 2007, 12:23
It's got nothing to do with WINNING ffs!

READ the question posed.

The irony is the men who had the BIGGEST effect on Saints over the last 20 years, had nothing to do with the football side: David Howes and Eamonn McManus.

Eddie Hemmings' Wig
2nd November 2007, 13:03
Eric Hughes built the squad that won Super League and started the ball rolling.

would we have won the double in 1996 without Goulding, Newlove, Perelini and Gibbs, or without the youngsters of the time that came through under Hughes.

All MacRae had to do was give them the belief that they could beat Wigan.

ploughman
2nd November 2007, 13:38
i agree with alf here,the club was on a slide downwords and hanley not only stopped it but we won the grand final against a supposedly superior bradford team.how we ever won that game i will never know.that is the belief hanley gave us.a close second is mclennon for similiar reasons.
the person who i think has had most impact on the club,for better, is david howes.true proffesional who took the club into the full time era and was the main man behind newlove coming to saints

Scouse Don
2nd November 2007, 14:12
Sorry Rvm you are correct-------still think Mcrae was a good coach and changed so much on the playing side and the training etc.
I think the playing side of the club was dramatically changed under McRae and the foundation of the current team built.(just my opinion)

Wellensisno1
2nd November 2007, 14:46
I fully believe we will not see the impact Anderson (abley assisted by Alan Wilson) on the club for another couple of years i.e. after he has departed.

Whilst most of the coaches mentioned have had some international class players to work with, it is Anderson who has sown the seeds and helped structure the development side of club beyond the first team.

RedVee Admin
2nd November 2007, 17:33
I think Mike Rush can claim half the credit for our current young players. The same goes for Nick Halafihi at the start of Super League.

Sausalito
2nd November 2007, 19:25
i agree with alf here,the club was on a slide downwords and hanley not only stopped it but we won the grand final against a supposedly superior bradford team.how we ever won that game i will never know.that is the belief hanley gave us.a close second is mclennon for similiar reasons.
the person who i think has had most impact on the club,for better, is david howes.true proffesional who took the club into the full time era and was the main man behind newlove coming to saints

Only for him we would now have a new ground courtesy of Owen Corning, but he didn't want their man on the board, it was Owen Corning money that brought Newlove to Saints.:???:

Kal-El
2nd November 2007, 20:23
McClennan for me, showed the team at the time just what could be achieved with a pint of lagerlol

THELAST3YARDS
2nd November 2007, 20:26
McClennan for me, showed the team at the time just what could be achieved with a pint of lagerlol

He just saw the window of opportunity.lol

Kal-El
2nd November 2007, 20:28
He just saw the window of opportunity.lol

;) lol

ploughman
2nd November 2007, 20:35
Only for him we would now have a new ground courtesy of Owen Corning, but he didn't want their man on the board, it was Owen Corning money that brought Newlove to Saints.:???:

i heard that owen corning wanted a lot more from the club than just a seat on the board,think about it,brand new stadium in straight swap for a seat on the board?there had to be more to it than that.
im sure that howes approached a lot of local businesses for interest free loans to secure the newlove deal.owens corning didnt fund the lot.

Haydock Saint
2nd November 2007, 20:46
Dave Rotheram for me.

In the short space of time he was in charge, he did a great job. Yes a bit of a blip at Hull, but Maurie's hacker certainly put a smile on the fans faces. And the win at Widnes... if we had lost we would not have won the hub cap. He set up the success for Anderson.

He's out of work at the moment and I reckon we should get him to replace Anderson

ploughman
2nd November 2007, 20:51
bad news,dave is head coach at workington

St.Ben
2nd November 2007, 21:46
McBeercan for me , he introduced new training methods at the club including the weighted sledges and new moves on the pitch (header over the line included) , playing a prop at stand off from a scrum (george mann), and was generally a breath of fresh air , apart from wasting that pint.....:D :D

Haydock Saint
2nd November 2007, 21:49
bad news,dave is head coach at workington

Mr McManus will have to "tap" carefully then.

Saints Alive
3rd November 2007, 15:19
I fully believe we will not see the impact Anderson (abley assisted by Alan Wilson) on the club for another couple of years i.e. after he has departed.

Whilst most of the coaches mentioned have had some international class players to work with, it is Anderson who has sown the seeds and helped structure the development side of club beyond the first team.

not wrong there.

Anderson has not only achived & maintained success but has kept up the building/develpment process for the future ( assisted of course by the likes of Rush & Wilson)
Andersons legacy will come to fruition over the next few years when the current crop of younger players start to make their names.

Scouse Don
5th November 2007, 11:19
Fully Agree.just hope there are a couple of quick young centres about!!

mrnike22
5th November 2007, 12:13
each coach brought there own techniques with them, obviously as already said McClennan madea bunch of part timers almost as good as a full time team, hughes brought the likes of prescott, cunningham and arnold into our team, mcrae could build on that with his ideas from down under, hanley brought in a rock solid defence in which we lacked, millward brought us the 'entertainers' tag, and then anderson put them all together introducing new techniques, bringing in our youth academy, having a rock solid defence and a good attack......all the foundations are there for our new coach, our new coach hasnt really got alot to do, just keep developing our youth system

Scouse Don
5th November 2007, 12:58
Blimey if it's that easy think I'll apply !

tongey
5th November 2007, 12:59
What about Eric Hughes. He got the kids coming through the ranks and then brought them into the team, and MacRae took most of the credit for it

Saint Bert
5th November 2007, 13:36
Hanley made a hell of a difference to the mind set of the players and started the club off in the right direction with regards to it's match preperations and professionalism that we see today on and off the field.

rob
5th November 2007, 13:53
Mrnike22 is spot on with his evaluation - each coach has brought something new to the side and built on the work done by the predecessor. It's highly unlikely in sport (or business for that matter) that you can suddenly turn from a poor performance into something amazing and successful. It takes time and experience. That's the evolution we've seen in the last 10-15 years.

I remember the bad-old-80's where we won nothing, which was tougher for me growing up in Wigan (long story). It's going to be just as much hard work maintaining our current success because everyone wants to better us! Wigan spending over the salary cap and still being mid-table mediocrity says it all - success takes time!

Reacher
5th November 2007, 15:08
I remember the bad-old-80's where we won nothing,

Given that you are only 18 you have done well to remember the 80s. You were not even born ;) :D

Reacher
5th November 2007, 15:09
I remember the bad-old-80's where we won nothing,

Given that you are only 18 you have done well to remember the 80s. You were not even born ;) :D

Oops, can tell I am tired, thought your age was 18 and it was number of posts. Sorry mate. Doh :o

DD
5th November 2007, 16:47
McRae, McRae, McRae...

PAH!

Despite winning cups, he took charge of a side that had already been built. All he had to do was guide it and to be frank, his record post-Saints isn't as glowing as it should be for such a wonder coach.



The question was: Which coach over the last 20 years has had the most effect on the Saints team?

McRae didn't have an earth shattering effect, he didn't change much, he just fine tuned what was already in place, then watched it slip away.

To answer the question properly, you need to look deeper into the club and the squad at the time, look at key signings, look at key departures, look at performances and attitude before and after; not just look at the silverware won.

The men who I believe definitely had the most effect on the club in the last 20 years are McLennan and Hanley, followed by Anderson.

Don't need to read any more. That is the definitive answer.

McRae knocked the team that Eric Hughes built into shape for twelve months. Only one of those players was brought in by himself (Derek McVey).

By the time McRae left we were in a worse shape than when he took over.

Who is to say Hughes wouldn't have done what McRae did in 1996 had he been given the chance. The signs had certainly been there in the centenary season that we were on the verge of something special.

scots saint
7th November 2007, 00:31
sorry, what about the chairman? we've hade several managers in a fairly short period, but surely the resurgence and subsequent dominance of the club, are down to the astute selection and support thereof by the chairman, of their selections of the person to do the best by the club?

How many of us thought McRae was the man ( a lot judgeing by this thread ) ?

How many of us wailed and despaired when Milward was sacked?

Give credit where credit is due.

Don't call me names in response!!!!!

Sausalito
7th November 2007, 13:18
sorry, what about the chairman? we've hade several managers in a fairly short period, but surely the resurgence and subsequent dominance of the club, are down to the astute selection and support thereof by the chairman, of their selections of the person to do the best by the club?

How many of us thought McRae was the man ( a lot judgeing by this thread ) ?

How many of us wailed and despaired when Milward was sacked?

Give credit where credit is due.

Don't call me names in response!!!!!

You are definitely right, saved a fast sinking club, deserves more from the fans who were knocking him a couple of weeks ago:saint: :saint: :saint:

Scouse Don
7th November 2007, 16:17
Gavin Murray by a mile !!

DD
7th November 2007, 17:16
sorry, what about the chairman? we've hade several managers in a fairly short period, but surely the resurgence and subsequent dominance of the club, are down to the astute selection and support thereof by the chairman, of their selections of the person to do the best by the club?

How many of us thought McRae was the man ( a lot judgeing by this thread ) ?

How many of us wailed and despaired when Milward was sacked?

Give credit where credit is due.

Don't call me names in response!!!!!

We know all that but the question is about coaches.

We can start one about chairmen if we want then Mrs Ellard could vote for their Tom, Mrs Latham for their Eric, Mrs Ashton for their Eric and everyone else apart from that daft •••• who wore the "McAnus" shirt two years ago can vote for Eamonn, but it would all be pretty much a foregone conclusion with the thread ending after half a dozen posts. ;)

Div
7th November 2007, 18:18
apart from that daft •••• who wore the "McAnus" shirt two years ago can vote for Eamonn,



I recall telling that guy to his face that his shirt was a f****** disgrace !! It was at some motorway service station.

sale_mike
8th November 2007, 00:12
Hanley or Anderson? It's a close call.

In the short time that Hanley was at the club he provided the belief to the players that they could beat other teams who were frankly better than us. Another season of McRae would have resulted in a downturn in our fortunes. Millward rode on the back of this turnaround in the club's fortunes in 2000/01 and was fortunate to find himself with a bunch of players at the peak of their careers (Long, Cunningham, Sculthorpe).

Anderson turned around a team who could beat anybody on their day into a team who could beat anybody on any given day.